Portal:𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰𐌱𐍉𐌺𐍉𐍃/𐌲𐌰𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌾𐌰

𐌲𐌰𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌾𐌰 𐌳𐌿 𐌽𐌹𐌿𐌾𐌰 𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰
𐌷𐌴𐍂 𐌸𐌿 𐌼𐌰𐌲𐍄 𐌼𐌴𐌻𐌾𐌰𐌽 𐌳𐌿𐌲𐌿𐌽𐌽𐌰𐌽𐍃 𐍆𐌰𐌿𐍂 𐌽𐌹𐌿𐌾𐌰 𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰. 𐌰𐌻𐌻𐌰 𐌿𐍂𐍂𐌴𐌳𐌿𐌽 𐌸𐌰𐌽 𐌿𐍆𐌰𐍂 𐌸𐌰 𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰 𐌾𐌰𐌷 𐌹𐌸 𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰 𐌲𐍉𐌸𐌰 𐌰𐌹𐌸𐌸𐌰𐌿 𐌱𐌰𐍄𐌹𐌶𐌰 𐍃𐌹𐌽𐌳 𐌰𐌳𐌼𐌹𐌽𐍉𐍃 𐌼𐌴𐌻𐌾𐌿𐌽 𐌸𐌰𐍄𐌰 𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳 𐌹𐌽 𐌸𐍉 𐌻𐌹𐍃𐍄𐌰 𐌼𐌹𐌸 𐌸𐌰 𐌽𐌹𐌿𐌾𐌰 𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰.
𐌲𐌰𐌲𐌲 𐌳𐌿 𐌸𐍉 𐌻𐌹𐍃𐍄𐌰 𐌸𐌹𐌶𐌴 𐌽𐌹𐌿𐌾𐌰 𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰.
𐌰𐍆𐍄𐍂𐌰 𐌳𐌿 𐌷𐌰𐌿𐌱𐌹𐌳𐍉𐍃𐌴𐌹𐌳𐍉𐌽 𐌸𐌹𐌶𐍉 𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰𐌱𐍉𐌺𐍉

inmaidjei

Why do give this as "change"? We already have a word for it "maidjan". The derrivation would be "maidjeins". This affects the other words derrived from that you posted. I'm going to change it. Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

The noun derrivation of maidjan would be maideins, wouldn't it? No j in the suffix. /Gadrauhts (talk) 16:09, 22 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Yes, of course. You're right. I guess that was a typing mistake. Thanks. =) Zylbath (talk) 16:05, 23 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

bokawaurda

Why don't you just use the word "bokos" as it is traditional? Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    I suppose it could work, but the word book and the word text have different meanings as we use them.

    I meant text as in "search the full text of this article", which is translated in almost all languages as

    a loan of "text". - Bleakgh (talk) 15:24, 27 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

I know what you mean. But in the Gothic language there was no distinction between the two words "book" and "text". We have to accept that, languages can differ in semantics and lexics. Zylbath (talk) 12:46, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

leinkan

We already have a word for it used on this wikipedia and mentioned in the list: hlagks. And the verb to that is also used on this wikipedia: hlagkjan. Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Furthermore, the spelling nk wouldn't be very gothic, would it? Gk should do it and 'ei' is redundant. *Ligkan would probably have been a better choice. But as said, hlagks/hlagkjan is already established and IMO much better. /Gadrauhts (talk) 16:07, 22 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

BTW, could you tell the me the etymology behing "hlagkjan"? I haven't found anything about it. Zylbath (talk) 16:13, 23 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Old norse hlekkr and modern swedish länk leads to protonorse *hlank-. Should come from the stem *hlenk- or *hlink- = to bend.

The form is lite satjan from sitan. Hlinkan => hlankjan.

/Gadrauhts (talk) 18:41, 24 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Aaaah, okay. Thank you. ;) Zylbath (talk) 21:48, 24 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

bak-

Why do you use "bak-" in the sense of "back"? This clearly derrived from English. The Gothic for it is: "afar" or in some contexts "hindar". Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    Some of these are already on translatewiki, and need to be changed. Sorry. Also, for some reason

    translatewiki changes haven't updated on here yet, but I suppose that that's a good thing.
    Bleakgh (talk) 15:20, 27 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, that's the big problem. Translatewiki closed the translation function for the Gothic Wikipedia. They said that we have to write in Gothic letters but the users translating the wikipedia back then used latin letters. I really prefer Gothic letters as this is traditional. But they don't want to open the function again. If you can effect the opening of that function I'd be pretty happy. Zylbath (talk) 12:49, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

maurgwaurdus

First of all this would be "maurgu-" because maurgus is u-stem. And second, I don't agree with this form. There is no word like "waurdus" which is masculine, the real word is "waurd" or "waurdi". But both wouldn't fit quite well. In the sense of "text" one should better use "bokos". And the sense "short+text" wouldn't match the semantical sense of "summary". Without laying the focus on German I would recommend something equivalent to "Inhaltsangabe": "innahalda-angaba". Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

weihta

How do you come to the sense of "event"? What is the etymology behind this word? Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    I got niuja weihta from translatewiki, for it was already there.
    Bleakgh (talk) 15:17, 27 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Ah okay. I just wanted to know since I couldn't find it. But I know its etymology but had no Gothic source. But it seems pretty proven that this words also existed in Gothic as it is quite typical for West- and Northerngermanic languages. Zylbath (talk) 12:51, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

wreitmahteig

Even if "wreit" seems to be cognate to the English word it wouldn't be a good word here. It has the meaning of carving and I don't think that a printer is still carving into the paper. The word for "write" is "meljan". But I like the ending "mahteigs", so I would say: meljamahteigs. Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

seidogawiss

What do you mean by navigation? The navigation on a website or the navigation with the device in the car? I think "gawiss" is not a good word for that. It means something like "juncture" or "ligament". I would say "wigatiuhands" which would be something like "way-leader" for "navigation device" and for navigation "wigatauhts". Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Gawiss is better for link, or as I usually use it, for union (e.g. European Union etc.). /Gadrauhts (talk) 16:03, 22 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

sundrawei

What is the etymology behind this word?? Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    The etymology is from sundro, meaning privately.
    Bleakgh (talk) 15:16, 27 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

And how do you come to "-w-ei"?? That ending is only traditional to one word "agg-w-ei". And even there the "-w-" doesn't even belong to the ending itself. And "sundrô" would stay the same when it is used in a compositum or derrivation: "sundro-...". I guess we should find a better ending here. Zylbath (talk) 15:23, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

miþnatifodja

I don't get why you use "miþ" but I don't agree with "fodja". This is very English and the Gothic word "fodja" is firstly wrong derrived from "fodjan" and second it really means the "feed" which is eaten by animals. The English expression cannot be so easily translated. Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    What about strau instead?
    Bleakgh (talk) 15:12, 27 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Why strau in the meaning of "straw"? Zylbath (talk) 15:23, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    Sorry, I meant rinno. I read the wrong word is all. Bleakgh (talk) 13:17, 29 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

I think "rinno" would be okay for it. Do you have an idea for a verb in the sense of "feeding the rinno"? Zylbath (talk) 13:49, 29 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    What about filljan, meaning to fill, as in "fill the river"? Bleakgh (talk) 00:00, 3 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

leista

According to the most grammaticarians "ei" was pronounced "î". But the use of "ei" has etymological reasons. "lista" is a loanword and would not get an "ei" for long "î". It would just be "lista". Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

faurthisskuggwa

We already have a word for "preview" which is at the bottom of every "edit page": faursaihva. Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    Sorry, fauthisskuggwa should be something more like "preview mode", because skuggwa means mirror or looking-glass.
    Really the only reason I added it here was because the word preview itself wasn't here yet.
    Bleakgh (talk) 15:13, 27 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Hmm, some wikipedian words seems not to be on this niuja waurda page. But I still don't get the real sense of preview mode which might be a cause of being no mother speaker. Do you mean something like a modus? The prefix would by the way be "faur" or "faura" but not "faurþis". Zylbath (talk) 15:23, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

databus

Where shall "bus" come from? oO Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    Bus is from the word base, but I changed the ending so it would be a gothic noun ending.
    Bleakgh (talk) 15:12, 27 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

No, I really wouldn't say we should use an aglizism here. We can built that word with Gothic words. I would say it could be: feilbairgo. We already have a word for file which is "feíla". I actually do not agree with this anglizism. But I don't know a better word for it for so far. The word would then mean "file keeping". Zylbath (talk) 15:23, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    I wouldn't use feila, since files and data are different. bandwjan means reveal information, which is close to datum/data.

With feil you are right. I don't like it either. But bandwjan doesn't mean exactly to reveal an information as we need it, it means rather "to give a hint" "to reveal a sign/mystical". What about dividing it into two senses: feil (or another better word) for computer files as what it means and for other things we could use "wairth" what data would mean in that context. "wairthbairgo" would then be a collection of data in the sense of values. Zylbath (talk) 17:35, 30 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

anaukanan

The verb is "aukan" or "auknan". The dictionary gives "anaukan", "biaukan". And since this is not a new constructed word I'm going to delete it to keep the list clean. The list is only for new words. Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 26 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Norway

Why does the word for Norway on this page not match the name of the page about Norway?

Bleakgh (talk) 15:43, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

This is because the list it stands in is from the gothic mailing list as you can see in the title. They don't have anything to do with the wikipedia. They created words aswell and such creation may differ. This is a problem. But I would prefer the word the wikipedia article has: Naurwigs. Zylbath (talk) 18:50, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Coffee

Since kafes is an irregular verb, could you please add it (in gothic script) and its declension to the English Wiktionary? Thanks.

What do you mean by irregular verb? Don't you mean noun? And why is it irregular? And why don't you add it? ;) The only people here reading this are you and me. Haha Zylbath (talk) 18:53, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    kafes was already there as an irregular noun meaning coffee.

There is no source for the Gothic word "kafes". If that word existed and they knew of "coffee" I would rather say it was something like "kahwa, w., f.". Zylbath (talk) 14:06, 29 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    It could be 'coffee - kafi, st. f.' Bleakgh (talk) 23:29, 29 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Why do you eliminate the fricative /h/? I think it should stay in that word since it was in the arabic word and the Goths could have only copied the word in earlier times and then there still was that fricative. Furthermore can't it be a "-i" declension as for that the criterias are: long vowel/diphthongue, short vowel + 2 consonants or more than one syllable. This is not true for this word. So the "-i" declension can't be applied here. I would still say it is just "kahwa". The arabic word had an "-a" at the end and was female, why should the Goths change this when it fits so perfectly to their declension? Mostly those cases are preserved from the original. Zylbath (talk) 12:26, 30 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

    Is this 𐌺𐌰𐍈𐌰 or 𐌺𐌰𐌷𐍅𐌰? Bleakgh (talk) 15:41, 30 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

At this point I'm not sure. But I would say it's 𐌺𐌰𐌷𐍅𐌰. Because then we can put it into the wa-declension. Zylbath (talk) 16:55, 30 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

nulls

I'm not sure about that word. First "nulla" would be female as numbers are mostly female. Second I would rather say it is "sifra, str. f." as it was in other languages like in Old Norse. Zylbath (talk) 19:01, 28 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Some Fruits

cranberry - cranbasi, st. n.
banana - banana, wk. m.
avocado - afokado, wk. f.
blackcurrant - swolbasi, st. n.
elderberry - hilbasi, st. n.
tomato - tomato, wk. f.
watermelon - watanmelo, wk. f.
olive - alewja, st. f.
plum - plomo, wk. f.
peach - firsaiko, wk. f.
cherry - kirsanbasi, st. n.

Bleakgh (talk) 23:48, 2 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

kranabasi perhaps? From *krans (masc. a-stem) = crane.

What are the origine of your other suggestions?
Peach, perhaps *pairsiko (i befor r never occures, and why f initially?).
/Gadrauhts (talk) 15:55, 22 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

I don't whether he will answer that fast. Do you maybe have some suggestions yourself? I think I don't agree with some of them above. And yes: "pairsiko" would be accurate. But I'll wait with transferring them to the waurdabokos until the rest is fine. Zylbath (talk) 16:11, 23 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

I haven't got suggestions for all but I can try to make some suggestions right now for those I haven't got any before.

cranberry - kranabasi, st. n. (from *krans = crane)
banana - banana, wk. m. (same as Bleakgh's)
avocado - abokado wk.f. (same pronounciation as spanish) or niqizapaira (lit. crocodile pear. niqis = crocodile [is my suggestion])
tomato - tomato, wk. f. (or perhaps tomat, st.n)
watermelon - watamelo, wk. n. (No n in wata-)
olive - alewja, st. f. or alewabasi
plum - pruna, st. f. or pluma (other germanic languages seems to have changed r>l and n>m)
peach - pairsiko, wk. n. (from latin malum persicum)
cherry - kairisabasi, st. n.(not quite sure though)

/Gadrauhts (talk) 19:12, 24 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

For "plum" I would suggest "pruma, st. f.". The proto-germanic word is "*prūmōn". And when we have the choice I think it is better to stick more closely to protogermanic, for me it's more beautiful. ;)

The etymology of cherry is pretty interesting. I couldn't find anything why the "-issa" was added to the indogermanic stem "*ker-", but in the proto-germanic language it was already "kirissa". It seems totally logical to think of "kairisa". But I wouldn't add "-basi" to it as it is proven in several germanic and later forms without "-basi". What do you think? Zylbath (talk) 17:34, 26 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Pruma and kairisa seem legit. I was probably influenced by swedish when I thought of cherry (körsbär). // Gadrauhts (talk) 19:07, 27 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Haha "körsbär" är ju gullig. xD Okay, then I'll add them to the list. And what is with the other two suggestions?

blackcurrant - swolbasi, st. n.

elderberry - hilbasi, st. n.

I don't know what "swol-" and "hil-" mean. Do they mean anything? Do you have maybe another suggestion? Zylbath (talk) 22:44, 27 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Goth. *basi, comes from Proto-Germanic *bazją. Moonspell the Goth (Mēnasáiþjis Gutan) (talk) 01:08, 23 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Alphabet

What about azbageda for alphabet?

Bleakgh (talk) 23:49, 2 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

I don't understand this one, could you explain it further? I'd use alfabeta or perhaps (little rediculous maybe) ansubairka (Godbirch) for the two first letters ansus and bairka. /Gadrauhts (talk) 19:18, 24 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

I guess it shall base on a, b and g. But now where you mention it, it's pretty odd. Your suggestion seems more appropriate. I'll add it. Is it neuter? Zylbath (talk) 21:45, 24 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Which one do you mean? *ansubairka would be feminine as is bairka. If you meant alfabeta it could be masculine perhaps. It was neutre in latin (alphabetum) and masculine in greek (alphabetos). /Gadrauhts (talk) 19:12, 27 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

No, i meant "ansubairka". I'll add it. Zylbath (talk) 22:45, 27 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Because the dictionary says it I used azbageda in an article, is that wrong? Bokareis (talk) 21:36, 21 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I have seen it quite often around here. I wouldn't call it wrong. We also have an article called 𐌰𐌶𐌱𐌰𐌲𐌴𐌳𐌰. But I think it is not as accurate as the others words suggested above. If you have the choice you should always take those. Kevin Behrens (talk) 13:04, 22 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Some Technology and Office Terms

calculator - abaka, st. f.
computer - kalkanmasjinus, st. m.
paper clip - maimbrananbinda, wk. m.
staple - maimbrananwida, wk. m.
keyboard - bistigqanbaurd, st. n.

Bleakgh (talk) 02:44, 3 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Please always search the niuja waurda list first before you post new words.

We already have words for computer - garahnja, keyboard - bokabaurd, paper - papeirus.

The word "abaka" wouldn't have existed. It never was female, in no language.

It would be "abakus" and masculine. I would say it's abakus, m. (u-decl.).

For "paper clip" I wouldn't use "-binda" since this would mean something like a "string" which is wraped around a paper.

Besides, I don't know why you divide between "staple" and "paper clip".

For both "papeirukrampa, weak m." would fit.

Zylbath (talk) 15:57, 3 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Chocolate

chocolate - kokolats Bleakgh (talk) 21:37, 14 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

I would rather say: sjaukaulada. Since chocolate is mostly female in gender languages and the [ʃ] sound is most common in this word. Zylbath (talk) 17:18, 15 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

brownie - sjaukauladokoks, st. f. (changing the ending of the work for cake because it's not a chocolate cake, but it's like one) Bleakgh (talk) 19:12, 15 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Etymological it would be:

sjaukauladakaka, st. f. - and would just mean chocolate cake. For brownie there should be found another word. I would say that an english word wouldn't be wrong here:

"brauni, n. ja-decl." The word would fit into the ja-declension of a neuter noun. Zylbath (talk) 20:22, 18 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Poet

waurdamuza (wk. masc. equivalent to declesion for man) for poet, (waurda + muza (from Gk. Μοῦσα)) Bleakgh (talk) 03:53, 19 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

or maybe skaulda from the Icelandic? Bleakgh (talk) 03:55, 19 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Well, since "skald" (poet) seems to be pretty common to germanic languages and it is attested for Old Norse I would say it's

"skald, str. n." in Gothic.

For poetry I am not sure yet what to take. There must have been an own word for it. I guess it was something like "liuþ" even if it means the same as "song". Zylbath (talk) 19:06, 19 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

it could be liuthskap or something like that (song + ship = songship)

Please always subscribe with

~~~~

. I don't think that the ending was that productive then and it wouldn't have the meaning to make a compound with "liuþ". I was thinking of something like "song art" as in Icelandic: "ljóðlist". But Gothic has no word for "art" attested. Any ideas? Zylbath (talk) 10:19, 21 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

It could be handugei or something similar meaning "craft"/"trade"/"skill". Bleakgh (talk) 17:33, 21 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Niche

The word location/place/niche (as opposed to a physical location) could be niks. Bleakgh (talk) 14:32, 26 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Niche is from French. So we wouldn't use it here. It derrives from the latin word for "nest". So in this case we should just use the Gothic word for nest which is

"sitls". I'll add it to the list. Zylbath (talk) 15:55, 12 𐍅𐌰𐍂𐌼𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Tangle/knot

hnopjan, wv. I, meaning to tangle and knot, st. n., meaning knot (most Germanic language use kn- instead of the Icelandic hn-, and knut already refers to knee/kneeling). Bleakgh (talk) 14:17, 29 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Knot would be:

hnots, str. m.; the verb to know would be:

hnotjan, -jan. I'm adding it to the list. Zylbath (talk) 15:52, 12 𐍅𐌰𐍂𐌼𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Website

I thought of "natistaþs, st. m."?! Zylbath (talk) 23:10, 27 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

I think that "nati" should mean just network, while we can make the equivalent of "world network", the internet, and "world network site/place" a website. Bleakgh (talk) 00:19, 29 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

"nati" is already the word for internet, you can look it up in the list of the gothic mailing list. (By the way it is not fatal that it has just the meaning of "net". In Germany we often say just say "Netz", too.) And as an equivalent to "web+site" we have "internet+place" = "natistaþs". Zylbath (talk) 09:17, 29 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Wabjaseido is the neologism for website. Bokareis (talk) 21:33, 21 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

And what makes you sure of this seemingly absolutistic statement? I mean 'natistaþs' was created two years ago and is already in use. 'Wabjaseido' looks just like a simple anglicism, and the form of 'seido' is wrong btw. we agreed on 'seida' for page. Kevin Behrens (talk) 12:42, 22 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

What makes me sure is that the user gadrauhts told me to use wabjaseido for website. Bokareis (talk) 22:06, 23 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Sentence

Do you have any ideas to form that? I am thinking of an old greek oriented form like: praso, w. f. or prasei, w. f. The last ending is often used for abstract nouns. I would prefer the last one. Zylbath (talk) 20:49, 30 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

I discussed this word with Gadrauhts, we agreed to use 'sateins', based on the English 'sentence' and German 'Satze'. Bokareis (talk) 21:32, 21 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I am fine with that, looks plausible. I'll add it. (As a sidenote: But English 'sentence' didn't derive from the same root as the German Satz, it came from Latin sententia 'opinion'.) Kevin Behrens (talk) 12:55, 22 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Syntax

I cannot think of a good word. But maybe it should base on the word for sentence if we find one. Zylbath (talk) 20:49, 30 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Where did Norwegian setning and Icelandic setningu come from? Bleakgh (talk) 18:17, 1 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

modern

What would you use for it? I think "maudern" would be too easy. There must be a creative way to say that. Maybe somethings like: "himma dagis" or "nuwairþs". Zylbath (talk) 21:11, 8 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Modern already has a word in Gothic, no neologism needed. 'present' is andawaírths, and you could basically use this same word for modern too. Bokareis (talk) 21:09, 4 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

painting

In the sense of German "Malerei", the art of painting, or the abstract thing. I would say: "frisahtandsei". Zylbath (talk) 21:17, 8 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

sculptor

What would you say for it? Maybe "gadigands"? Or according to the German word "Bildhauer", which is pretty pictographic, "frisahtaslahands"? Zylbath (talk) 21:43, 8 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

anatomy/anatomist

I cannot decide whether we should assume a latin lownword "anataumia" or a gothic made up word: "leikkunþi" for "anatomy". A anatomist would then be "anataumists" or "leikkunþjands". What would you prefer? Zylbath (talk) 21:51, 8 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

polymath

Maybe "allakunþjands"? Zylbath (talk) 22:18, 8 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

culture

I think we should make a loan word here: "kultura, str. f.". Zylbath (talk) 20:04, 10 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Can it also be "us-met, sn." The word is used for a "behavior or way of doing things." I also use the word for "lifestyle." Moonspell Bloodlines (talk) 19:26, 16 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014

(UTC) When I need to write the word culture in Gothic, I just use the same word for society, that is what culture basically is. Though there is a slight difference in meaning, but I can't find newly invented words. What is the oldest Germanic word for culture? It might be best to use that Bokareis (talk) 00:43, 24 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

verschiedentlich (on various occasions)

In German there is this word "verschiedentlich" which means something like "in different ways". In Gothic there is a word called: "analeiko" which means "in the same way". We could then make a word up that means the difference: "anamisso". What do you think? Zylbath (talk) 20:14, 10 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

In addition to that word, we could use: "antharleiko", which has mostly the same meaning. Zylbath (talk) 20:15, 10 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

position

I'm orientating on the german word "Stellung". "stellen" means "satjan" and "Stellung" or "position" would be "sateins, str. f. (-i)". Zylbath (talk) 20:48, 10 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2012 (UTC)

Translations

A better Gothic translation of German Shephard is Þiudiskisks Skepa-haírdeis-hunds. (sa Þiudiskiska Skepa-haírdeis-hunds means the German Shephard.) We equally need translations of nation, national, inter-, and a lot of other words. (The page must be editable.) 90.12.176.229 09:59, 15 𐌺𐌰𐌻𐌳𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

In fact, we already have a translation of "nation". See here or here or here under Þiuda-. The actual dictionary will be protected because of vandalism and also because of the word finding process. New word creations should be discussed here before they come into the dictionary. I think that's a better way before everybody is putting his or her word creations without review into the list. That would be a pure mess. So if you want to discuss new words, wish that somebody would create some or have ideas for new words just post them here and start a new topic. Zylbath (talk) 13:35, 15 𐌺𐌰𐌻𐌳𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I am the one who invented that word, I was wondering about what German Shepard would be. I had to break the word down, Þiudiskisks "German", Skeps "sheep", haírdeis "herder or Shepard", hunds "dog." Literally "German sheep-herder-dog." Moonspell Bloodlines (talk) 19:19, 16 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Anthropology

Can anthropology be manna-leisei, sf.? I think so because it means "man-study" or "the study of mankind." As is the word anthropology, Ancient Greek ἄνθρωπος (anthropos, “man, mankind, human, humanity”) + -logy. Moonspell Bloodlines (talk) 04:33, 29 𐌲𐍂𐌰𐍃𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Usafhlaþ

(Copied from 𐌸𐌹𐍃 Wikipedia 𐌲𐌰𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌾𐌰:Nuijis waurds)

I don't know if this has an impact to the correctness of the derivation of the Gothic word, but the German word "her" has two meanings: "ago" and "to here"; and in the word "herunterladen" it is used in the second meaning: "her-unter-laden" means "load down to-here". Regards, 𐌷𐍂𐍉𐌸𐌱𐌰𐌹𐍂𐌷𐍄 17:17, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Having looked into Gerhard Koeblers Gothic dictionary, I suggest: dalaþlaþan. "Dalaþ" means both English "down" als well as German "herunter". 𐌷𐍂𐍉𐌸𐌱𐌰𐌹𐍂𐌷𐍄

Oops. That's what I get for using babelfish to translate her. Changed. --Jacques Pirat 21:54, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

I have a new suggestion for the word 'to download'. A new word for Gothic has been recently found, 'atdraga', which means 'to pull down'. It might be the perfect translation for 'to download' and a Goth in the modern time would maybe call it like this. However 'load' + 'down' is used in most languages this would however be a good use of an old Gothic word. Bokareis (talk) 21:15, 25 𐌱𐌻𐍉𐌼𐌰𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Some new word proposals

Ok, as I can't edit this page and I need to translate a website in Gothic, I will do some word proposals here for words which I simply can't find here but which need a word in Gothic. I will edit this part if I find new words, I just want to hear if there are better proposals here. If there aren't, I will simply use these words. I will also explain why I use all these words.

translation - in-meideins (this simply is the word 'change' in Gothic, which is some kind of translation of 'translation') The etymological origin of Latin however is: "a carrying across, removal, transporting; transfer of meaning,"

There is already a word for 'to translate': 'gaskeirjan'. We can tighten the meaning to the extension of 'to translate'.

I wrote this when I wasn't that good in Gothic yet. I always use 'skeirjan' for 'to translate' because the dictionaries give that meaning. Is it a big problem that I use skeirjan without the ga- prefix? Bokareis (talk) 22:21, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I think with 'ga-' is better, but it is not such a biggy to not prefix 'ga-' to it, but it would be better to use this causative prefix. Kevin Behrens (talk) 12:49, 22 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

So if you prefer another word, I can fully agree on this, as I have the feeling that in-meideins isn't the best translation.

button - hriggs (this is the word 'ring' in Gothic, if an old Goth would have lived in these days and saw a button on a computer screen, I think the most likely word he would use was 'circle', so maybe hriggs isn't such a bad word for a button, as we don't know what button was in Gothic.)

I guess I would go with the other languages that almost always use the allegory to the look of a 'button/knob'. So I'd suggest 'knuppa' mn.

The problem is that I already used hriggs everywhere.... And is knuppa attested, because it's better for us to use rather attested than unattested words.Bokareis (talk) 22:19, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

That you used words somewhere else can't be always the reason for not taking another word. '*knuppa' is reconstructed and used by most Germanic languages for 'button', even in English, but with a word from French (but carrying the same semantics). Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:26, 21 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

The problem is that knuppa is not attested, while hrigga is in fact attested, aren't we safer to use a word which the Goths definitely knew instead of a word which is a reconstruction while you have an alternative? A button in fact looks like a ring, so it isn't that much of a strange choice. Although, only some buttons are a circle. Can we also use hriggs for buttons in the form of a circle and for the others knuppa?

Bokareis (talk) 21:31, 21 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

There are differences between reconstructed words. And in this case we can very surely assume that it was used as 'knuppa'. And I am still advocating for it because first almost every Germanic languages uses it and second the semantics of 'ring' don't fit perfectly with the semantics of a button, a ring is a ring and a button has more content in the middle than a ring does. A ring would be a circle but not a flat. Kevin Behrens (talk) 12:49, 22 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

philosophy - þagki (the noun of the verb 'waurdjan' (to talk) is 'waurdi' (talking), the verb of to think is 'þagkjan' and however we can do the same with the word economy and have a direct borrowing, I think it's better if we, just like in Icelandic, try to create original words when it's possible.)

If you'd derive 'philosophy' from 'þagkjan' I'd suggest something like 'þagkeins' fu. But even that would cover the meaning of 'philosophy'. I would go with the Greek word here: 'filosofia' fa. (Philosophy is the 'science of thinking' or 'the thinking about thinking'. To name it only 'thinking' would cover the meaning.) I would do the same with 'aikonomja' fa.

policy - runa (which is the word 'plan' in Gothic, as in 'Gods plan'. A policy is something which the gouvernment or an organization wants to happen, just like Gods intentions to let certain things happen, so the word 'runa' might be the most appropriate word here. The word is used here:

"the teachers of the law rejected God's plan for them" witodafasteis fraqethun runa gudis ana sik.

Don't you think that 'runa' is far too unspecialised for that meaning? It doesn't cover the meaning of 'policy' or describes it any further. It must be a word that really denotes what it means. As it is borrowed from Latin/Greek in almost every language I would go with 'politeia' fa.

gender - kuni (same word as family, in German we use Geschlecht and in Dutch geslacht, which etymological origin can be found here, my source is the etymological dictionary:

c.1300, "kind, sort, class," from Old French gendre (12c., Modern French genre), from stem of Latin genus (genitive generis) "race, stock, family; kind, rank, order; species," also (male or female) "sex" (see genus) and used to translate Aristotle's Greek grammatical term genos.

So, the same word as family seems legit to me.

'kuni' has rather the meaning of 'tribe' or 'race'. I would go with Germanic cognates for which 'kunja' mn. was reconstructed.

administrator - ragineis (We have a lot of choice here, ragineis might be the best word as it means both a ruler and a councellor, a councellor was someone who ruled a city. Ruling a city means also maintaining policies and such and not just ruling without having obligations)

I would rather use a word that comes from 'andbahti' for that has the meaning of 'administration'. So, maybe 'andbahts' ma.

Bokareis (talk) 19:30, 2 𐍅𐌰𐍂𐌼𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I couldn't find a word for 'to authorize' so I came up with:

waldufnan

Based on the word: waldufni (authority), changing it to a verb by changing -i in -an.

Bokareis (talk) 22:07, 5 𐍅𐌰𐍂𐌼𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

We already have a word for that 'waldan'. 'waldufni' derives from that word.

I have translated 'unregister' as:

*us-meljan

Based on the verb 'to register' which is:

ana-meljan, as 'ana' is a preposition which means 'in' here, I thought that it would be logical to take the verb 'out', which is 'us', for unregister.

Compare it to Dutch: uitschrijven, this word is used as a negation of 'inschrijven', inschrijven means 'to register' and 'uitschrijven' mean to unregister, so it's used if you don't want to be a part of a municipality anymore. Bokareis (talk) 22:44, 5 𐍅𐌰𐍂𐌼𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I'm fine with that. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:56, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

On Loanwords

(Transferred to Portal:𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰𐌱𐍉𐌺𐍉𐍃/𐌰𐌻𐌳𐌰𐍅𐌰𐌿𐍂𐌳𐌰#On_loanwords.) Zylbath (talk) 14:01, 24 𐌰𐌺𐍂𐌰𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

To click

I recommend the following neologism and old Gothic word: kramjan kramjan means 'to press' in Gothic, and not 'to press on a person', for which you also find a lot of translations. My other neologism is 'klikjan'. As Dutch, English and German have equivalents of this word too. Bokareis (talk) 21:31, 4 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I would go for 'kramjan', for 'click' is onomatopoeic for the sound of 'clicking'. In German and Dutch is more an anglicism than a cognate. But on the other hand I am not quite sure about its semantics. The only translation says 'to press', right. But I guess it is rather meant as 'to seize', 'to scratch' or 'to cram' (same word btw). I guess I said somewhere once something about '𐌸𐍂𐌹𐌿𐌺𐌾𐌰𐌽', as reconstructed from ger. 'drücken' or nl. 'drukken'. But I am not quite sure whether that is also the best choice. Some words I made up when I started with Gothic. (But I wasn't really firm in reconstructing, so I am not really sure about it. Zylbath (talk) 11:28, 5 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Judaism, Christianity

I needed to add them to the categories as 'judadoms' and 'xristwadoms', but I am not sure whether it is good this way. Do you have any ideas? Zylbath (talk) 10:54, 9 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Judaism: Iudaiwiskei or Iudaiwiskismus. Christianity: Xristismus or Xristiskei, maybe. --Shikku27316 (talk) 01:53, 15 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC).

Do you have similar words where that is attested? Kevin Behrens (talk) 18:08, 15 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Jewish is "Iudaiwisks". Christ is "Xristus". I put the suffix -ei onto them; it means something like "-ness". --Shikku27316 (talk) 21:39, 17 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

If the suffix -ei is appropriate here I would say yes to take this. Bokareis (talk) 23:18, 17 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Near/Middle/Far East

What would you say about 'fauraasia' for Middle East? Cognate to 'Vorderasien' in German. But I would be fine with a construction with 'middle' in Gothic, too. Any suggestions? Kevin Behrens (talk) 21:34, 9 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Why modern German? If the Goths would have used their words nowadays in modern times I don't get why they would use modern high German.

I recommend something like, and correct me as I don't know how to combine words: midjis-austra. Midja-austra. I don't know how to write it. fauraasia looks rather strange to me and I don't know this in any other Germanic language, it isn't used in Dutch, not in English, not in Scandinavian languages, only in German so why would you use it in Gothic then if it is not a shared word in all Germanic languages? That doesn't make sense. Bokareis (talk) 02:03, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I didn't say they borrowed it from German. I just used it as an example because 'faura-' is quite productive in Gothic. Gothic doesn't always have to take the quintessence from all Germanic languages and only those forms that are attested in most Germanic languages. But as I said, something with 'middle' is fine with me. The problem is just that in every language the borders between the different Asia regions are quite different and not distinct. So we have to take the same blurry definitions like in English or elsewhere.

But maybe we could find a totally different form for Near and Middle East since the Crimgoths lived there. Maybe they could have, hypothetically, taken an own word, also denoting the home of the Crimgoths. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:56, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

If that's the case we don't know it anymore. I think that it's best if we choose the Middle East in Gothic, because what we are doing here is designing a modern Gothic. It needs to be an accessible language and if we make up new words which are completely different from other languages, you rather discourage people from learning modern Gothic than motivating them. I got to idea to maybe create a website to learn Gothic in the future, but I will wait until we have some standard forms for words etc. I discourage 'fauraasia' because not only Germanic but also Romanic languages use an equivalent of middle east, like French "le moyen-orient", therefore a rendering of middle east would not only be accessible for a lot of people, but simply also the most likely. I have another question, could you change Peru in just the word we already designed, I believe it was Pairu, now it says Igkaland and no one uses it or wants to use it, so that makes it a useless word. Bokareis (talk) 21:48, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Unattested

I have chosen the word 'unweitwodiþs' for that, coming from 'weitwôdjan' - to attest. What do you think? Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:31, 9 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Looks fine to me if weitwodjan is indeed "to attest". It's a -jan verb so you indeed have to use -iþs here. Bokareis (talk) 02:04, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Message

What word would you use for 'message'? I would say 'mêreins' for it. Kevin Behrens (talk) 11:07, 14 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Mereins is a good word, but the creator of the oe eclipse dictionary came up with "sanda" and when I translated Polyglot Club I used this neologism everywhere for message. I think it isn't that bad as it's derived from "sandjan", which is changed to "sanda". It makes really clear what the word is, something which is sent. Bokareis (talk) 02:00, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Okay, then we could take both words with different meaning extensions: 'mereins' is rather general and 'sanda' is clearly for electronical sent messages. So a 'sanda' would be also a 'mereins'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:56, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Well, possible, but let's first at which definitions you want to use it for. Digital messages are sandos in plural, but Wulfila also used the Latin word aipistaule for letters, so it makes the most sense that we simply follow Wulfila in this, as he wouldn't have used that if the Goths had a word for it. So we could use aipistaule for sent messages as letters. So, would mereins become a message brought with your voice instead of in a written form? That could work. Bokareis (talk) 21:44, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

There is more than 'letter' and 'electronic message'. We are speaking of the message as on Facebook and the abstract meaning of a message. I am actually not quite happy with both of the words as they actually mean something else and don't really fit to the meaning of 'message' as we want it. Maybe we should have another approach. Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:24, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Well, we can get rid of aipistaule, but "sanda" is already used in so many places in my translations that it will be a hell to remove it all again. And is it really useful to remove it as 'sanda' basically gives the meaning of a sent message between two persons. But as for facebook messages etc. I agree with you that 'mereins' is a good word, as 'merjan' originally ment something like: to spread a message, to announce. And that is basically what you do. If we use mereins for personal messages too it can get confusing as you aren't spreading a message among a lot of people, but just with one person. Bokareis (talk) 22:28, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Again, just because a word is used in many other occasions isn't always a reason for it. 'sanda' doesn't fit the semantics here, it rather means something like 'shipment', a package is sent somewhere (not message). 'mereins' wouldn't fit either, it would mean 'announcement' which is semantically different to 'message'. So, I would change both of them and try to find a better fitting one. But as for now I cannot think of something, I've not free head. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:33, 21 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Well, modern English uses 'to send' and Dutch 'verzenden' for packages too, only German is different with 'schicken', but it can be used for messages too. The Goths couldn't send messages like us at the internet, so of course they didn't have a word for that. I don't really get why we can't use sandjan and sanda for sending messages at the internet. Bokareis (talk) 21:27, 21 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Germans also use 'senden' synonymous to 'schicken'. I am not speaking about the verb. 'sandan' is totally fine for 'sending a message '. But calling a message 'sending' or 'sanda' looks quite strange to me, it would be 'sending a sending' then, 'sandan sanda'. As I said, we should come up with a better word. I will give it some thoughts today and tomorrow. Maybe something better will come to my mind. We could also take a look at other old germanic languages like Old Norse etc. Kevin Behrens (talk) 12:43, 22 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Well, we have got the word aipistaule from Wulfila, so if you really think it's strange we could decide to simply use it, it's also not a neologism which would make it appropriate.

Some other words have this too though and sound fine, like gift. To give a gift doesn't sound strange at all, I agree that send a sending sounds strange, but it doesn't go for all words which are the same in verb and noun-form. Bokareis (talk) 22:09, 23 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

All I am trying to say is that we cannot reanalyse words with other meanings because they are just sooomehow in a neighboured semantic field. Of course, in general, it is better to stick to attested words. But in this case we don't have a real word for 'message' in the abstract sense. So, we shouldn't try to find an attested word and force it into this semantics for all one is worth. If you reeeeally want to take 'sanda', go for it. I can't forbid you to take or use it. ;) But epistaule is the word for 'letter' in Gothic, which should stay that way. It sometimes happens that an old word gets reanalysed to another meaning. So, a 'message' and a 'shipment' would be polyphones in Gothic then. Kevin Behrens (talk) 09:53, 26 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Item

I would use something like 'alone standing' --> 'ainakls' and 'link' (part of a chain/mass) --> *hlenks ----> ainaklahlenks, st. m. (In Low Saxon: Enkellenk, in German: Einzelglied) Or would you use an anglizism like 'aitem' st. n.? Kevin Behrens (talk) 11:55, 14 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

First we need to look at, what is an item here?

I would say the existing word: "waihts", seems to fit the descriptions. Bokareis (talk) 01:59, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

No, I don't think it fits here. 'waihts' only means 'thing'. That could be anything. An item is a distinct link from a row or mess. That meaning isn't coded in 'waihts' at all. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:56, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I don't really understand your explanation. Do you mean at websites? I would prefer the English loanword in that case. Bokareis (talk) 21:43, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

No, 'link' also has another meaning: a part/an item in a row/mass. That is attested for most of the Germanic languages. So, I think it would be nice to have it here, too. Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:18, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I 'm not sure yet. Bokareis (talk) 22:30, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Information

I would use 'uskunþi' -ja n. cognate to German 'Auskunft'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 12:19, 14 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

There is already a neologism for information. David Conolly has made a list with neologisms which someone else bundled for me in a PDF file. He came up with 'infaúrmatsjon', in fact ALL languages use the word information in their own spelling so why would we not do this with Gothic? That's rather unnatural.

I will send you the list later but I 'm using this neologism for all things I do know and if you are going to change the word for information I will simply not use it and continue with this neologism because I have used it in so much places already. Bokareis (talk) 01:58, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Maybe both could be used. The notion and concept of an 'information' must be known to Goths as well, that's why they had words like 'kunþi'. I am fine with a borrowing of 'information' along with 'uskunþi'. All Germanic languages have different words for the concept of 'information' along with 'information'. But I am not quite sure about the form used here. 'information' derives from 'īnfōrmātiō' which is female (as [almost] all borrowings are). Goths would use the i̯ō-declension for words with several syllables. That would make 'infaurmati' fjo. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:56, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Ok, so it would become infaurmatsjo I guess? Then I just need to remove the last n in all my translations of the word. As for uskunþi, couldn't we also use a word like kunþi for the same meaning? You use the prefix us- here, that's possible but how does the us- prefix makes clear that it's information? Bokareis (talk) 21:42, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

If it would be converted correctly by Goths, then, no. It would stay as 'infaurmati' fjo. in nominative case. In other cases the /i/ turns into a /j/ plus the respective ending. 'Kunþi' is also possible in this semantic field but still carries a slightly different meaning than 'infaurmati' or 'uskunþi'. It extends morely the meaning of broader 'knowledge', 'ufkunþi' carries the meaning of 'information' that is used to inform someone about something (a bit like 'inlichting') and 'infaurmati' could be the general, abstract 'piece of information'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:14, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Ok, but is infaurmati really correct? Isn't it infaurmatsji? Furthermore I think it sounds good what you say. I think we can at least build up a basis here and when we can have a professional looking website we could add a good dictionary. Ĩ will add all accepted neologisms to my dictionary. Bokareis (talk) 22:17, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

It looks stranger, but if it is derived correctly it has to be so. It has the same declension of the Latin original. And the pronounciation of {-tion} as /tsion/ is mostly a phenomenon of modern languages for that pronounciation only occured in later Latin. Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:34, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

to print

I would use 'þrukan'/'þrukjan' for printing. It is cognate to the Germanic languages and '*þruks' is already reconstructed as ger. 'Druck' in Gothic. Kevin Behrens (talk) 12:34, 14 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

As we already use 'kaúrjan' for 'to click' I think this isn't too bad. In order to prevent confusion it can be used. But in Dutch we have for example: 'afdrukken' when we print something. In German I believe 'abdrücken' (not sure), if it's a good idea, try to find a good alternative in which you also insert the af / ab- preposition. Bokareis (talk) 01:57, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Where have we used 'kaurjan' for 'clicking'? I wouldn't think that's the best solution for 'kaurjan' means rather to put weight on something that just 'press'. I thought we said 'kramjan' would be better for it.

In fact, like in German, in most Germanic languages 'to print' and 'to press' were the same words. Only later they became slightly different like in German 'drucken' and 'drücken'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:56, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Is that the case? Oh, I read somewhere that you agreed with kaúrjan so I used kaúrjan everywhere where I needed to translate the word 'to click' because Koebler dictionary wasn't clear about it. I guess I need to change everything all over again, I will change it to kramjan. What is kramjan exactly? Bokareis (talk) 21:39, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, if I said yes to 'kaurjan' somewhere else. Sometimes it is hard to keep up with all the different occasions or word creation. ;) That is why I would always try to do it here, unless we will find a better and easier solution sometime. 'kramjan' has the meaning of 'hit, push, pinch', so the meaning of giving little pressure (like with the finger) on a surface, in opposite to putting weight on something what means 'kaurjan'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 21:46, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

mobile

I would suggest something cognate to German 'handlich', so --> 'handwaleiks' maybe? Kevin Behrens (talk) 13:53, 14 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I recommend to not do that. German word uses are often restricted to German and the worst you can do. Try to find universal Germanic uses of words, that's why I always do. Or try to have a direct rendering of Latin. Could you add international = miththiudisks to your dictionary? I use this as it's a direct rendering of 'international' = inter (between) national (nations), miththiudisks basically has the same meaning.

I use it at my news website etc. so I recommend to insert it, as if you don't insert it, we will have different word uses in different places.

The neologism for phone is: faírrahausjands / faírrarodjands

mobile in the sense of mobile phone, could be based on the Gothic root for to move, movable.

Wigeinisks faírrahausjands = movable far-hearing.

Bokareis (talk) 01:54, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

It is surely not the worst thing to do to take a look at how German works. Icelandic and German morphology are one of the most complex withing the Germanic languages and still show the most traces of Old Germanic morphology.

Even English has 'handy' for German 'handlich'. By 'mobile' I not only meant that a phone can be mobile, I meant morely the extension of 'handy'. For the meaning of mobile in 'phones' we could maybe derive something from 'bairan' for 'to carry'. I guess that covers the meaning of 'mobile' better than 'to walk'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:56, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

term / condition

I would suggest: 'bilageins', st. f. from 'bilagjan'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 14:01, 14 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I came up with a word for term when I was translating Polyglotclub, I will look it up for you later. It looked like bilageins I think. Bokareis (talk) 01:55, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

institute

In the sense of research I would suggest: hruskastaþs, mi. 'place of research* Kevin Behrens (talk) 23:06, 18 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Possible. But as the word institute is used in all Germanic languages I recommend a Gothic phonological adaption to this word. einsteitut? We could of course also offer a Gothic neologism and the word itself, institute in the Gothic way.

Sokastaþs might be possible too, but sokjan maybe has a bit of a different meaning. I think your hruskastaþs is better. Bokareis (talk) 02:06, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I would be also in favour of both words. In German you could also possibly say: Forschungsstätte. But that's hardly used. I would use a Latinised word 'einstitut' na. Only the first /i/ was long in Latin, I suggest, Goths would orientate on that. Kevin Behrens (talk) 09:24, 19 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

to upload, a problem here

I looked at the dictionary and I found, to upload:

'ushlaþan', may I ask what it is based on? This looks more like removing your download to me, because of us-. Uploading means something like putting it on the web, so I wondered if a literal translation like 'iupalaþan' would be good or maybe 'analaþan'. Bokareis (talk) 21:51, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

grammar

Someone lecturing Gothic came up with the following neologism: maþlakunþi. I also sometimes use 'gramatika' as the loanword-alternative. I have used maþlakunþi quite a lot, is it also a good neologism for grammar? Bokareis (talk) 22:23, 20 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Trees

oak – áiks (fem. i-stem)
maple – hluns (masculine a-stem), mapuls/mapls (masculine a-stem)
rowan – saúrbus (masculine u-stem), ráuns (masculine i-stem)
ash – asks (masculine a-stem or i-stem)
birch – birki (feminine jo-stem)
beech – bōki (feminine jo-stem)
hazel – hasls, hasals (masculine a-stems)
fig – smakkabagms (masculine a-stem—already attested)
linden – lindi (feminine i-stem)
dogwood – kaúrnila (feminine ō-stems)
box tree – baúhsus (masculine u-stem)
elder – alþiza (weak masculine a-stem)
elm – ilms (masculine a-stem)
spruce – unknown
pine – peinus (masculine u-stem), paíwki (feminine jo-stems)
redwood – sekwaúja (feminine o-stems)
yew – eiƕs (masculine a-stems)
willow – wiligs (masculine a-stems)
fir - taírwi (neuter ja-stems)

Many of these are loanwords. Some are also not final (such as the following: “pine”, “dogwood”, “spruce”, “willow”, “rowan”, and “maple”). Please provide feedback. --Shikku27316 (talk) 01:24, 22 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

For spruce I derived from English spruce, coming up with "spráiws", does that work? Moonspell the Goth (Mēnasáiþjis Gutan) (talk) 00:08, 23 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I think "spráiws" might be a bit hard to say; something more like "sprusa" would work better. But, only English really uses the word "spruce" or anything based on it, so it might be better to see what German, Icelandic, Latin, etc. do. --Shikku27316 (talk) 16:48, 23 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

gadfly

For the word gadfly, can we use "brimusei"? I got the word from my friend Anulaibaz Gautafriþuz on his Proto-Germanic literature page on Facebook, he was talking about a gadfly, in his case a *bremusī, which he called it a "Cool nice beautiful word." Moonspell the Goth (Mēnasáiþjis Gutan) (talk) 00:15, 23 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

"Gothic horror"

The ancient Goths have no direct relation to the modern literary genre of "Gothic fiction". The link is a very confusing deal: "Goth" came to mean anything barbarian or Germanic, and basically was applied to architecture and art that developed in the Holy Roman Empire and France. These people were rivals of the Goths, so it wouldn't make sense that the Goths would have used their name for what was devised by their enemies, and was also considered by everyone all around them to be barbarian. They would have distanced themselves form these art forms for these reasons, and perhaps would have called it "barbarisks" or "fragkisks". Then, it came to mean anything mysterious or romantic/wistful, and, by that extension, the literary genre that takes place in Gothic buildings and features wistful and mysterious ("Gothic") elements. The Goths, by now, would not have even used the word "gutisks" for this kind of thing, since they always called the architecture something else. Also, their own people weren't very mysterious to them, as they knew their culture and suchlike. This is assuming that they had survived into the present day. So, the literary genre would have never been, in the Gothic language, known as "Gothic". I'm thinking that, for the art form, we use one of my suggestions above, and, for the genre, perhaps we could do what German does: they call it "Schauerliteratur", which would be, in Gothic, "skūra[literature]". The French also have a name for "Gothic novels": romans noirs. We could also borrow "noir" into Gothic as "nwar". It means "black literature", and I think it makes more sense to use German or French as our basis--lots of this literature comes from those languages, and they are big countries in literature anyhow. Also, for the "Goth subculture", we might want to use something else, too, simply to avoid confusion. I can't think of anything, though, so I need others to help me with this. --Shikku27316 (talk) 17:01, 23 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

No need to use 'nwar', swarts is already reconstructed. I think that this term doesn't have a very necessity to be thought out yet. But if we really want to, I would use something like 'dark literature', which covers Gothic horror basically. Bokareis (talk) 22:14, 23 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Alright. So, "riqizeino bokoleisei", or "riqizabokoleisei"? Which is better? (About "nwar", I figured we'd end up scrapping it. I just thought it would be pretty--my synesthesia makes that word black and murky with purple in it, so it made sense to me.) Also, what about the Goth subculture? Again, I don't think they would have gotten this name had the Goths survived as an ethnicity (though, of course, they didn't, and we have to have this make sense).--Shikku27316 (talk) 22:58, 23 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Uh, I use gutiska undar-us-met, undar (under) + us-met (behavior, or way of doing things) or would swarta-undar-us-met be more appropriate since you use swarts to refer to the gothic or horror literature? The goth subculture is influenced by this style of literature (as I am a goth myself) but I came up with a problem. If you use swarts to mean the subculture, and you call yourself a goth in Gothic, "I am a goth" (Goth. Ik im swartan) literally "I am a black" don't you think that's a little racist? I would say "Ik im gutan", this is something I wanted to throw out there. Moonspell the Goth (Mēnasáiþjis Gutan) (talk) 00:49, 24 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Bokareis and I agree on using something based on "riqis" for the genre of literature, so I think the subculture should use something based on "riqis" as well. I think something like that wouldn't cause any problems. Also, we could still suggest something else--I'm not against revisiting the "skūrabokoleisei" issue, even if "skūra" means "storm". I understand that lots of people have used their own ideas in their personal writing, but, as a community, we need to agree on words. I think going with the "riqis" option would help to avoid confusion. Or, we could also do something with German "dunkel" or Swedish "mörk". Everyone, feel free to give suggestions, too. --Shikku27316 (talk) 18:44, 24 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

There is a problem with our community anyway. The dictionary is flawed at this website, so I created a new dictionary myself to which you can contribute, http://gothicdictionary.wordpress.com/

This is supposed to become a reliable list in contrary to the current Wikipedia list to look up words and submit them. You don't need to use it but I found this as the best alternative. Bokareis (talk) 21:10, 24 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Okay. But, here, we can discuss them before we accept them; I think that website is good to store them and submit idea, though. Who is going to bring all of the words we've accepted here to that website? I am too busy to help, though I may find some time. (Also, I know this isn't the place, but I can't use the Yahoo group, so look at this that I made.) --Shikku27316 (talk) 21:13, 25 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I can put the words there, but it has a nicer lay-out than this wikipedia so it might be better to use in the meantime. I can also send you and Moonspell Bloodlines an invitation in order to be able to change the main post in which all the neologisms can be found if you are absolutely sure that a word is good. 84.26.254.29 22:21, 25 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I think just you should change the page, I guess. We can all still discuss words in either place. --Shikku27316 (talk) 22:31, 25 𐍅𐌴𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌴𐌽𐍉𐌸𐍃 2014 (UTC) So, have we decided on a word yet? --Shikku27316 (talk) 19:03, 2 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Gender

The word "kuni" has been used for "gender", but it also means "kind", "type", etc., which could be confusing. Could there be a more specific word, perhaps based on "kuni"? Also, Gothic is lacking in gender-related terms, such as "trnsgender", "genderqueer", etc. I propose 'transkuni' for transgender, or "diakuni". "Genderqueer" might be harder Any suggestions? Mine for "neutrois" is also "niutraújs". We can also do other LGBT terms. Any thoughts? --Shikku27316 (talk) 22:53, 5 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I think for trans- (Latin for cross) we can use "ufar", as does Anglish, over. But Anglish terms for transsexual are she-man, he-lady, ladyboy, folkhalf shifter and folkhalf switcher. In Gothic, we could use qinomanna "woman-man", isfráujo "he-lady", ufarkuni "transgender". Though I have no clue about queer, I have derived Gothic word for gay and a gay person, but not really the vulgar term queer. The Anglish words for "to cross" is thwarse and stride over. For LGBT terms, I have skular "a gay man" (from German schwul), lesbisks (lesbian) (Germ. lesbisch, Swed. and Dan. lesbisk) Moonspell the Goth (Mēnasáiþjis Gutan) (talk) 18:32, 6 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

You cannot borrow words from modern Germanic languages without looking at the history of that respective word. The German word 'schwul' derived from Low Saxon 'schwul' meaning 'oppressive hot'. German also adopted that meaning, too, by changing it to 'schwül' in analogy to 'kühl'. Thus, It cannot be used to derive a Gothic word for 'queer'. But I really like this discussion and I am looking forward to other ideas. Albeit the 'concept' of homosexuality has been relatively unknown or marginal to Goths. I guess they didn't even have a word for it or used christian terminology. It has been very likely a taboo subject that nobody spoke about, thus, no real words for it, probably only paraphrases like 'having intercourse with the same sexe'. But I agree that we should find a neutral way of saying this since modern Goths of nowadays also have to overcome (religious) prejudices and face normal biology. ;) Kevin Behrens (talk) 20:56, 6 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

It is what you call normal. About 20 years ago homosexuality was a psychiatric disease, is pedosexuality just a preference too instead of a disease? I don't want a whole discussion here, I just say it to show that it isn't that simple, philosophically. I don't have problems with homosexuality personally by the way. As for homosexuality, I think that the best alternative would be something like, read me if I say that this definitely isn't exactly a good way to say homosexuality, but I don't see any other way to say it with the attested words: " man + love " = mannafrijaþwa, I think. If you want to use the Latin base-form, you can turn it into: " same + love " = " analeikafrijaþwa ". As for women which love each other, you could use: qinofrijaþwa. I don't know, maybe I 'm completely wrong, just some ideas. Bokareis (talk) 21:50, 6 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

The question is, whether you want to reconstruct an emancipation progress in that language, like going from hatred to acception. But that would be maybe too much. For we live in the 21th century and people like me are finally recognised as normal we should find neutral words for it. I guess a cognate to 'same sex love' could be taken like 'galeikakunjis frijaþwa' (analeiks means 'similar', in this case I would prefer 'same') like German 'gleichgeschlechtliche Liebe' or English 'same sex love'. But maybe we can also come up with some synonyms, like many languages do have more than only one expression for homosexuality. Kevin Behrens (talk) 23:09, 6 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Yes, homosexuals don't hurt others with their feelings so it's good that it's considered normal, that's why I don't have personal problems with it. As for genetics, it depends on what you consider normal. Even if it is abnormal, it should be accepted as people didn't choose to become homosexual and like I said, they don't hurt anyone. There are problems with a lot of groups regarding this however. Autistic people for example still aren't accepted completely while they can't really help it how they are, it's good that some first steps are made with some groups, including homosexuals. I 'm not really sure about transgenders though, it could have a very big negative impact on your life to change your gender.

I like your word 'galeikakunjis frijaþwa', seems better than the words I came up with. Bokareis (talk) 00:14, 7 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

The change of your gender when you are transsexual is not something you just came up with recently. It is based upon a disorder of your sexual identity. The changing is not a expression of creativity to get a new look but rather an adaption to your real sexual identity, for it didn't match your outer look before. Of course it is a big impact on your life, but for most of them it is fore and allmost a relief. And homosexuality is not to be regarded as 'acceptable' because they don't hurt anyone or despite it could be genetically abnormal. Sexuality has many ways to express, heterosexuality, bisexuality, pansexuality, homosexuality etc. All of them are normal expressions of sexuality, not one of them worse or better then the others, they just differ in frequency. And homosexuality has by the way its evolutionary purposes. Sorry for this off-topic excourse, just wanted to make sure. ;) The discussion is still open for further suggestions for 'transgender', 'gay', 'queer', 'lesbian' and other words for 'homosexuality'. We could also translate the newly released Facebook list of different sexual identities which counts about 30 different expressions. ;) Kevin Behrens (talk) 00:36, 7 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I wouldn't quite enjoy using "she-man", "woman-man", and "man-woman". Transwomen, for example (burn as males but identify as women) are not "man-women", but just women. They're not "she-men" either. This is why "transkuni" or "trnsahmakuni" would be best. For "gender", why not something like "soul-kind" be better, since it describes the identity of your soul? (Also, anything suggesting "half" or "two" is out of the question, as there are more than two genders anyways.) I propose "ahmakuni". "Genderqueer" and "non-binary" could be described with "unbeinareis" or something? I don't mind borrowings here, since, unless we want a big clunky word, they'd help a lot. "Homosexual" could be "galeikaseksuals" or "haumoseksuals" (every other language in Europe uses something ike this except Greek, whose "kinaidos" could become "kinaidus" in Gothic, but it might mean something else anyway), "bisexual" could be "twáiseksuals", "pansexual" could be "allaseksuals", "asexual" could be "unseksuals", "heterosexual" could be "aljaseksuals", etc. "Qinomanna" could be "androgyne" or the like, as well as, perhaps, "twisks" (adj. and noun). As I've mentioned, "neutrois" could be "niutraújs" (neuter a-stem; the "-s" does not go away), or "spad" from Latin "spado" (eunuch, but repurposed). It would be a neuter a-stem. "Genderfluid" could be "ahmakuni-flōbēreis". "Aliagender" could be "alja-ahmakuni". The neuter gender of adjectives could describe those of us who are outside the gender binary. How about that? --Shikku27316 (talk) 18:48, 7 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Responses? --Shikku27316 (talk) 02:09, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I'd go for 'transkuni'. 'transahma' sounds too spiritual to me for a medical/psychological term to me. By 'soul-kind' for 'gender' do you only mean the use of 'gender' in a modern emancipation process or 'gender' in general? I guess 'kuni' is short and concise. And gender is not only psychological or in the soul of someone, gender also manifests in the morphotype, the body, the chromosomes etc. (Of course in way more forms than only two.) Maybe it would be too spritual, too. 'unbeinareis' is fine for me. 'galeikaseksuals' and 'homoseksuals' could be synonyms. (I would go with 'homo-' rather than with 'haumo-' for both 'o's are long.) For 'bisexual' I'd rather say 'biseksuals' for most of the world's languages, even the Germanic ones, use that prefix. I would proceed with most of the other words like 'panseksuals', 'aseksuals' (There might be semantic difference between 'unseksuals' and 'aseksuals'.), heteroseksuals ([sic!] for it is a long 'e' and not a short one.) etc. The question is do we need a shorter word for heterosexual like 'straight' in English? Not every language has it. We could say 'heteros' for males and 'hetera' for women (like its Old Greek counterpart) as many languages just use that short form. I wouldn't take 'niutraujs' for 'neutrois' since 'neutrois' is an English invention and we could or should either take it is that 'neutrois' or use the other terms for it like 'kunilaus' or 'unkuni'/'akuni'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:51, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Well, "kuni" can mean any type of class, such as gender, species, nationality, etc., but "ahmakuni" is the only one that describes, basically, the "kind" or "class" of your soul, which basically encompasses all of your feelings and personality. "Kuni" on its own does not denote this in particular (and, with new Tumblr identities and all that jazz, there can be multiple interpretations of the word "transkuni", such as "transspecies" and "transethnicity", so "transkuni" isn't specific enough). I'd advocate for something like "ahmakuni" in all Germanic languages, actually, since it makes more sense than just "kind" or "type". (The soul identities involved in otherkin and therianthropy can be called "saíwalakuni/saíwlakuni" since it refers to the identity of the whole soul.) "Straight" could be "heterus" (masc. a-stem) and "hetera" (fem. o-stem), like other languages. I think it's okay to borrow "neutrois", since publications in Japanese, German, Spanish, etc. that I've seen just use a form of it. It's quite different from "non-gendered", since it's neutral, but that is the identity of a neutrois person. We have gender, just it happens to be neutral, almost between "agender" and "aliagender". That's at least my understanding. Either "niutraújs" or "spad" (neut. a-stem) could work; maybe that second one can mean neutral-gender in all its forms: neutrois, agender, and genderless, perhaps. They're still very close to each other. "Niut" can be a short "slang term" if you will. "Neutrois" in that form does not conform to Gothic phonology enough, either way.And, I think that, if everyone is okay with using the Greek prefixes for "homosexual", "bisexual", etc., then it's a go. --Shikku27316 (talk) 19:49, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

So use niutraújs to mean asexuality? Moonspell the Goth (Mēnasáiþjis Gutan) (talk) 20:05, 20 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

No: neutrois --Shikku27316 (talk) 23:34, 14 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)`

Colours

Warning: I wrote another essay below!
"Colourful" is attested as fáihs, so "colour" should be "fáih", neuter a-stem. Now, as for colour words, "red", "black", "white", and "purple" are attested. I've seen "gēlws" for yellow, and "grōneis" for green (why -eis, though?). I’ve also seen "blēws" used for blue. As for "indigo", the word in Spanish, Portuguese, and Arabic is "anil" (Pt.), "añil" (Sp.), and "an-nīl" (Arabic). This would most likely become Gothic "aneils". It’s the best idea, in my opinion, since all the languages that surround(ed) the Goths used this word. For "orange coloured", I think either "gēlwaráuþs" (yellow-red) or "fōngēlws" (fire-yellow) would be good. I use "fúnguls" for Vandalic, by the way, so just saying. Of course, the option of something based on "orange/narancio" is also available. Thoughts? --Shikku27316 (talk) 19:49, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I would use 'farwa' for colour, since that is attested in Gothic and cognate to almost all Germanic languages. 'fáihs' means rather German 'bunt'. In English you might think to much of the notion of 'colour' because the word 'colourful' contains it. I am fine with the rest except that I would rather use a derivation of 'orange' as in other languages, 'yellow-red' seems a bit too forced to me. Kevin Behrens (talk) 10:08, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

In my translation of Alice in Wonderland I needed to translate 'orange' and 'marmelade'. I translated marmelade as: marmalada, and orange as: "oraggs", in which the dative which I had to use was: "oragga". As orange in languages like German and Dutch and other languages often uses a long vowel instead of a short one, I recommend the use of "o" instead of "au". Is this a good alternative for orange? Bokareis (talk) 16:53, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

(I changed the beginning message to this section, since it looked better.) Where is "farwa" attested? I couldn't find a word for "colour" anywhere. "Oraggs" would be good for sometihng relating to the orange fruit (which is what "orange marmalade" is talking about, and not the colour), but the colour could perhaps use a different word. In Swedish, I see they use "brandgul" alongside "orange", so why not the same with Gothic? We could have "gēlwaráuþs" and "oraggs". I'd like that, perhaps. (Also, "orange" in "orange marmalade" should be an adjective, right?) But is "aneils" good? And, why do all the ja-stem adjectives end in -eis, when they should end in -jis? I'm asking on behalf of "grōneis". --Shikku27316 (talk) 19:57, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

As it turns out, "farwa" means "form, shape, external appearance", and not "colour". I'm willing to revisit "fáih", unless anyone else wants to use "kolorus" or "lits", through analogy with Old Norse "litr". Or, of course, anytihng else. --Shikku27316 (talk) 20:58, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Sorry, but I would still advocate for 'farwa'. Köbler translates it as 'Farbe' and it is the same word that is used by many Germanic languages, if not all in earlier stages. Sure, the semantical extension then was broader than today, also including the notion of 'form' and 'shape'. But still, we have a Gothic word with it for colour, even if it has synonyms. 'Farwa' goes back to Germanic 'colourful'. 21:19, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

I completely agree that we should use Koebler for Gothic words. I use Koeblers assumptions for the days of the week too. Bokareis (talk) 21:29, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Well, if that's the best option, I'm on board. It makes sense if you think about it. --Shikku27316 (talk) 21:46, 9 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

centipede and millipede

For centipede I derived hunda-fotus (hunred-foot, as the Latin centi- (hundred) and -pes (foot) and hunda-lagjis (hundred-leg) for centipede (I recently watched Human Centipede: The First Sequence and Human Centipede 2: Full Sequence and wanted a Gothic equivalent to it's Dutch and German sisters), similar to German Hundertfüßer (hundred-footer) and Dutch duizendpoot (thousand-leg). For millipede I have þūsundi-lagjis and þūsundi-fotus. Moonspell the Goth (Mēnasáiþjis Gutan) (talk) 20:00, 20 𐍆𐍂𐌿𐌼𐌰 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

New word for comment

Currently I find biquths, without any stem and without a gender, which makes the word useless if you want to use it, as the stem and gender are unkown. I don't know if it's correct though and I made these observations: This word, it means, to notice, to observe, to take notice of, the problem is that I 'm not sure if "perceive" and "notice" also apply well to this word, because perceiving something and noticing something is basically what a comment is. But it is mostly an opinion. gaumjan 16, gau-m-jan, sw. V. (1), m. Dat., perfektiv: nhd. bemerken, erscheinen (= Pass.), seine Aufmerksamkeit auf etwas richten; ne. attend to, pay attention to, take care of, see to, perceive, notice (V.), take notice of, observe. Maybe gaumeins or gaumi? Could we possibly use "mitons" which means "opinion"? Or is that not a good solution? I need to know, as I come across the word "comment" a lot in my translations.

Bokareis (talk) 22:45, 6 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

Most languages just use something based on Latin "commentum", why not "þata kaúmaínto" (on-stem)? Or, based on Icelandic "ummæli", we could have "so umbimaþleins/umbimaþlo" (i/o-stem; on-stem). --Shikku27316 (talk) 23:26, 14 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)`

I guess we two agreed on 'biquths' ma. for 'comment'. We could include 'kaumainto' as a synonym. But I find 'biquths' quite creative, we should not miss it. Kevin Behrens (talk) 23:39, 14 𐌾𐌹𐌿𐌻𐌴𐌹𐍃 2014 (UTC)

𐌰𐌼𐌰𐌶𐍉𐌽𐌰