πŒ½πŒΉπŒΏπ„πŒ°πŒ½πŒ³πŒΉπƒ πŒ²πŒ°π…πŒ°πŒΏπ‚πŒ³πŒΎπŒ°:Zylbath

π†π‚πŒ°πŒΌ Wikipedia

FYI, I replied to your questions at Wikipedia:πŒ±πŒ°πŒΏπ‚πŒ²πƒ_πŒ±π‚πŒΏπŒ½πŒ½πŒ°#Survey_on_this_wikipedia Allsbairhts 10:36, 18 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2011 (UTC)

Use of accents[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

I just saw the article "AΓ­ppel" and figured that the use of accent probably should be avoided in the articles. They are mostly used to show pronunciation when there is any doubt or in educational books. Here does it make it more difficult to search. It's just my oppinion though ^^ --Gadrauhts 18:13, 31 πŒ°πƒπŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2011 (UTC)

We could either make redirects then or really avoid every accent. The Gothics haven't used them, right? Zylbath 18:17, 31 πŒ°πƒπŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2011 (UTC)
I would prefer to avoid them entirely. Accents weren't used by the goths. It is only used in modern times especially to learn the difference between Γ‘i and aΓ­. I don't think they are necessary at all. Redirects could work though, if the article itself doesnt contain any accents. --Gadrauhts 18:24, 31 πŒ°πƒπŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2011 (UTC)
Okay. Then I have to avoid them. Thanks. But still, I find them beautiful =P Zylbath 18:36, 31 πŒ°πƒπŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2011 (UTC)
I think the accents should be kept. That's just me though. Moonspell Bloodlines (talk) 20:41, 25 πŒ²π‚πŒ°πƒπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Well, the accent are actually only used by linguists/germanists. First of all the Gothic script should be default here and the latin script is just a transliteration. And there is no reason why suddenly there should be accents since the Gothic script doesn't use them either. Of course, they can be helpful with pronounciation. But we don't write here linguistically; latin script should only be used at some places and they are a transliteration then, and that one doesn't use accents, and also no hyphen by the way. Zylbath (talk) 08:41, 29 πŒ²π‚πŒ°πƒπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Translations requests (fr.wiktionary)[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Je mettrais les mots Γ  traduire ici, ne te presse pas ce n'est pas urgent, je repasserais de temps en temps en attendant la rΓ©ponse ;) . Si tu ne connais pas le mot, ou que tu ne comprends pas un des sens c'est pas grave juste dis le moi. Je souhaiterais les traductions en allemand et en bas saxon si possible. Si il y a plusieurs faΓ§on de le traduire n'hΓ©site pas Γ  toute me les indiquer. Je crΓ©erais moi-mΓͺme l'article (pour ne pas t'embΓͺter avec les conventions). En tout cas je te remercie d'avance pour l'aide que tu nous apportes. EDIT: Ou puis-je trouver les font gothique pour lire ce wiki ? V!vΒ£ l@ RosiΓ¨re /Murmurer…/ 17:30, 19 πŒ°π†π„πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2012 (UTC)

  1. rééduquer (il y a 3 sens diffΓ©rents) nds: ??? / de: ???
Je vais te repondre sur la wiktionary francaise. Sur la page gΓ©nΓ©rale il y a un box avec un text en anglais. Ou tu peux aussi chercher pour le Ulfila font. Ca c'est le font dont tu as besoin. ;) Zylbath 18:41, 19 πŒ°π†π„πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Template talk:trans-top[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hallo, Zylbath. Sie haben eine Antwort auf en:wikt:Template_talk:trans-top#How_does_this_work.3F. Stephen G. Brown 01:19, 31 πŒ°π†π„πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Vielen Dank fΓΌr die Benachrichtigung. =) Zylbath 10:09, 31 πŒ°π†π„πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Your temporary access is going to expire soon[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hello, you were granted temporary adminship in this wiki which is going to expire in a few days. Just to let you know that if you want to continue as an administrator here, you need to request an extension on stewards' permission request page on Meta-Wiki. Usually you only have to make a local announcement on your local village pump or request for adminship page, and if there are no objections after no less than three days, your request will be fulfilled. Additionally, if you think the community is big enough to elect a permanent administrator, you can place a local request here for a permanent adminship, so stewards can grant you the permanent access. Please ask me or any other steward if you have any questions. Thank you! Trijnstel (talk) 20:37, 18 πŒΊπŒ°πŒ»πŒ³πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

As / like help[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

as (LIKE) swe; "AS...AS" swa...swe; "white as snow" hweits swe snaiws; "he became as one dead" warth swe dauths; "as I said before" swe ju fauraqath; "in the same way as" sama-leiko swe; "AS THOUGH sitting down to a great meal" swe at mikilamma nahtamata anakumbjandans; "SUCH AS" swa-leiks swe; "AS MUCH" swa filu +gen.; "AS MUCH AS" swa filu swe; "AS MANY AS" swa managai swe; "AS GREAT" swa-lauths (gen. swa-laudis); "AS LONG AS" swa-lauth melis swe; "AS SOON AS" bi-the, suns-ei; "JUST AS, in exactly the same was as" swa-swe; "JUST AS...SO TOO" swa-swe...swah, swa-swe...swa jah; "AS FOR, as to, regarding" bi +dat.; (FOR, BECAUSE) auk (Usually placed after first word of sentence); (SINCE, GIVEN THAT) thande; "as/WHILE he was speaking..." nauhthan imma rodjandin...; (WHEN) swe; "AS IT GREW LATE" swe seithu warth; (USED AS, FOR) "as/for manure" du maihstau; "AS AN EXAMPLE" du fri-sahtai; (being, to be, ACTING AS: noun in apposition) - "to give his life as a ransom for many" giban saiwala seina faur managans lun.

this is from www.oe.ecplise.co.uk/nom/letters.htm


I did not create this dictionary, but I find it to be quite helpful.

Bleakgh (talk) 20:41, 25 πŒ²π‚πŒ°πƒπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)


For words, especially loanwords, like byte (πŒ±πŒ°πŒΉπ„) and bit (πŒ±πŒΉπ„), I propose a new "consonant" declension.

(table deleted)

Hails. Ah okay. I think the dictionary of KΓΆbler is still the best, because it is the best researched one. To your new declension class: I do not agree with this. I don't see a reason for that. Germanic languages are not to be know to invent new declension classes for stranger and loanwords words. Generally, that's pretty uncommon to languages. If we invent something like a "Neogothic" we should try to stick to the origins as much as possible. And Gothic is a language that has pretty many loanwords and adopted them pretty consequently to their declension system. Zylbath (talk) 15:36, 26 πŒ²π‚πŒ°πƒπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)


table deleted as it's taking up space.

Also, the dictionary of Koebler is in German. Jeg ikke snakker tysk, beklager. Time for Google Translate?

I see, the dictionary itself uses English.

Niuja Waurda[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

How does one get the words to agree when making new words, and which langauges are the most acceptable for loaning? Would french or spanish or even swedish be pushing it? Bleakgh (talk) 15:26, 27 πŒ²π‚πŒ°πƒπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Hey. I'm sorry for being so hypercorrect with the words. ;) I don't mean no harm. The first tip I could give is to look how the other words are made up for so far. There is gothic mailing list, I don't whether you know them, and they already made a big list of words. They are in the lower list on the page of the niuja waurda page.
To the languages used for loanwords: Our premise is to stick to the original gothic as much as possible. That means that we use the word formation rules we already know and they seem to be enough to built new words. We already have a comparativly big set of words. And with these we try to form new words. That's the main aim we follow, to built new words an compounds with old words or change the meaning of old words which are or wouldn't be not used anymore to get a new meaning. So, instead of taking an English loanword we use: garahnja for computer by using an own Gothic set of word formation possibilities. When that doesn't work or sounds very odd we can use loanwords. The two typical languages for that are Latin and Greek. The Goths had a long and intensive interference with these two languages and took a lot of Latin and Greek loanwords. Latin loanwords are at the same time very common to other indogermanic languages. Take English for example, half of the vocabulary is from romanic languages. There might be cases where a modern word from English seems to be most appropriate, as for "Faisbok" etc. But a word like "database" would be a good candidate to get a original Gothic name. Then we can use many loan translations. That means that a word formation structure is taking of a language and transferred to Gothic by using gothic own words. "Faursaihva" is such an example being equivalent to "pre-view".
Another way is of course the etymological derrivation. Since we still have many germanic languages and know a lot about sound changes we can follow a word back to Auld Gothic Times. In the cases where a form is not traditional but could be reconstructed by other germanic languages and this reconstruction is very safe the words are often already added to dictionaries, like the KΓΆbler one or the one you already posted here on my wall.
For orientation in terms of finding new words the scandinavian languages are quite good. They have a lot in common with the eastgermanic languages. Another good candidate are High German and Low German. They are concerning the vocabulary and some grammatical features very conservative and still have a lot of forms which were already typical in older times. For creating new words these languages might help a lot.
English might also help in some cases. But it is not such a good candidate. I already mentioned it before, English had a loooot of influence from other languages and lost a lot of its germanic vocabulary, 50-60 % are from romanic languages, espacially french. In addition to that the language made a big change and changed a lot which one can see in the loss of a lot of grammatical features.
I hope this helped you somehow to understand what is important for new words. It is not easy to construct new words. One have to know a lot about the word formations of Gothic. Zylbath (talk) 12:43, 28 πŒ²π‚πŒ°πƒπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Gothic Wiktionary[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

I have the Gothic Wiktionary in the incubator, and I had a few questions.

When you start out with Category being called Category, then it's changed to a different name, do all the pages have to have the [[Category:Wt/got/???]] changed to [[Blahdiblah:Wt/got/???]]?

And I would love to join the association of the gothic langauge.

Bleakgh (talk) 15:37, 27 πŒ²π‚πŒ°πƒπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

The wiktionary wouldn't be such a bad idea. But I think the problem is, that it will never leave the incubator but stays there forever. We don't even have participation here, how should the wiktionary work then.
I'm sorry. I don't know much of the incubator. Have you already articles there? In which name does the categories change?
Do you know German? It's not an obligation for joining the association, don't worry. But the homepage and other things are in German. ;) If you want to join send an email with your full name to: info@vereindergotischensprache.de. You will then receive a member confirmation. It's all for free and you can exit at the end of every month you want. Zylbath (talk) 12:05, 28 πŒ²π‚πŒ°πƒπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Voting Method[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Maybe you should use a parliamentary method for when new words are created, then have a word created on the Gothic Wiktionary for documentation, with at least one language's translation on the page. The more we're all on the same page, the better and less hassle.

Yes, I already have a lot of ideas for the new sprachausbau portal. Such a review programme will be also there.
What's that thing now with the Wiktionary? I don't know where to find articles there, are there any already? Actually I'd like a gothic wiktionary. But I don't see a reason in there. I think it's morely a fun thing but not for serious. The aim of wiktionary is to explain stranger words IN the giving language, that would mean in Gothic. But that would be quite hard because most Gothic interested people would need a explanation of Gothic in their mother tongue but not vice versa. That's the problem with dead languages. But what your/our aim is, is to built a gothic dictionary. But that could also be solved here without having the stress of writing enough articles in the incubator to get opened officially. The standards there are hard. The time spent there could better be spent here. We need more articles, with a good quality. With the amount of articles here we would have never passed the incubator. But the gothic wikipedia was built before the incubator, so it's still available. Zylbath (talk) 22:26, 28 πŒ²π‚πŒ°πƒπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

latin script[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

maybe it would be a good idea to only put the latin script there for the summary at the top, and then leave the rest in gothic script

Bleakgh (talk) 22:55, 24 πŒ±πŒ»π‰πŒΌπŒ°πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Hey, sorry, I don't really get what you mean. ^^ Only the summary of an article should be in latin script and in the boxes at the top? Not a total copy of it? Zylbath (talk) 08:10, 25 πŒ±πŒ»π‰πŒΌπŒ°πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

The latinska meleins template should be used for the first part of the page, followed by the same in gothic script, then the automaticallt generated table of contents, then the rest of the page also in gothic script. That way the pages aren't massive (in bytes, of course) and the table of contents doesn't end up in the latin script part.

Bleakgh (talk) 19:33, 25 πŒ±πŒ»π‰πŒΌπŒ°πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I don't really understand what you mean. Could you give me an example? Zylbath (talk) 17:26, 12 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Please Block IP[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

please block 205.213.117.254 if it causes any more trouble.

Sysop[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

How can I also become an administrator? Bleakgh (talk) 21:24, 9 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Hey, sorry, I had so much to do with all my stuff and projects. Why do you want to become an admin? I think you should wait some time before you become an admin. Zylbath (talk) 15:09, 12 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

It seems you are the only active admin on this wikipedia, and like you said, you were busy on projects and stuff. Bleakgh (talk) 21:02, 12 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

There are global sysops filling in for the lack of local admins here.--Jasper Deng (talk|meta) 21:03, 12 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry that I wasn't that present writing for 3 or 4 weeks. Which doesn't mean that I wasn't watching what is going on. I was mostly every second day here to watch out for some vandalism or so. I will try to be more present. But if you need something done by an admin just ask me, I'm most of the time at my computer and would be here in few seconds. ;) But more than delete or protect pages can't be done by an admin. You as a normal user can also move pages etc. You wouldn't need admin rights to do the most things here. And since there is not much going on here one admin is enough I think. Zylbath (talk) 22:32, 12 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Spring and Autumn[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

I can't find the gothic words for Spring and Autumn. Bleakgh (talk) 21:13, 12 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

This is because no words are attested. I was also already wondering about words for it. Some people say that the Goths only knew two seasons. Others don't know what indogermanic word to take. Here is a citate from the gothic mailing list:
> The season-word we can be the most confident about is "wintrus", occurring
> in John 10:22. "Asans" is attested for summer, but it translates Greek
> words that seem to have a sense of "harvest": theros and therismos. I do not
> know whether for the Greeks the harvest was regarded as part of summer; but
> if so, perhaps Wulfila would have chosen some other word if he had not been
> influenced by the language he was translating.
>
> As for the other seasons, I do not know whether there was much uniformity
> among the Germanic peoples in their names for spring and autumn, since it is
> said they divided the year into only two seasons, winter and summer. The
> German Lenz (cognate with English Lent) is said to derive from len(gi)zin,
> from *langat-tin, which had the meaning "having long days". Icelandic "vor"
> looks like Latin "ver", but whether they are related I do not know.
>
> The word German and English share for "autumn" is Herbst/harvest. How this
> is related to Icelandic "haust", if at all, I do not know.
- by Grsartor@aol.com

There are also many other propositions. Zylbath (talk) 22:39, 12 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Maybe before-winter and before-summer. π†πŒ°πŒΏπ‚π…πŒΉπŒ½π„π‚πŒΏπƒ and π†πŒ°πŒΏπ‚πŒ°πƒπŒ°πŒ½πƒ? Bleakgh (talk) 01:54, 13 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Hmm, maybe. But we can't proof that. And in those cases it is better to stick to a etymological stem like we have in other germanic language. In fact, there have been propably different names for the seasons; any maybe there wasn't even a word for spring and autumn. Zylbath (talk) 08:30, 13 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)
haust comes from the old norse "haust", and it is related to harvest Bleakgh 13:10, 14 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)
My method is find out what it would be in Proto-Germanic. I derive Gothic words from Proto-Germanic based on Gothic's grammar rules.

In Proto-Germanic, the seasons are *wintruz, *harbistaz, *langatΔ«naz (So named because the days become longer again in spring) and *sumaraz. In Gothic, they would be wintrus, *harbists, *laggateins and *sumars respectively, (akin to Old Norse and Old Saxon sumar). Moonspell Bloodlines (talk) 00:50, 4 π†πŒ°πŒ½πŒΉπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Well, that's what we'd reconstruct. But the question is whether those words were really used or there were others words. If at all there were fours words. As I mentioned, some also estimated just two distinguished seasons in the Gothic culture. ("asans" for summer is attested, not "sumars", and opposes "wintrus".) Zylbath (talk) 09:30, 4 π†πŒ°πŒ½πŒΉπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

MediaWiki name space[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

http://translatewiki.net/w/i.php?language=got&module=namespace&title=Special%3AAdvancedTranslate --Tadiranscopus (talk) 08:55, 16 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Okay. Thanks. Bleakgh (talk) 15:03, 16 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Your temporary access is going to expire soon[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hello, you were granted temporary adminship in this wiki which is going to expire in a few days. Just to let you know that if you want to continue as an administrator here, you need to request an extension on stewards' permission request page on Meta-Wiki. Usually you only have to make a local announcement on your local village pump or request for adminship page, and if there are no objections after no less than three days, your request will be fulfilled. Additionally, if you think the community is big enough to elect a permanent administrator, you can place a local request here for a permanent adminship, so stewards can grant you the permanent access. Please ask me or any other steward if you have any questions. Thank you! Trijnstel (talk) 12:21, 26 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Schriftarten[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hallo, jetzt erst lese ich deine Nachricht aus 2011. Kannst du mir ein Bildschirmabbild von den Problemen mit der Schriftart schicken, damit ich besser verstehe, worum es geht? (Ich nehme an, du bist derselbe Kevin, der mir schon geschrieben hat; meine Email-Adresse hast du dann ja schon.) Was den Link zu meiner Schriftart Ulfilas auf der Hauptseite betrifft, wΓΌrde ich empfehlen, ihn auf meine neue Adresse robert-pfeffer.net/schriftarten umzulegen. Zum einen kann dann jeder selbst entscheiden, welche Schriftart er haben mΓΆchte, zum andern ist auch immer gewΓ€hrleistet, dass er die aktuelle Version findet – denn von Zeit zu Zeit verbessere ich mal wieder etwas. Fontspace dagegen kann schonmal veraltet sein. (Und außerdem freue ich mich natΓΌrlich immer ΓΌber Besuche meiner eigenen Seite.) πŒ·π‚π‰πŒΈπŒ±πŒ°πŒΉπ‚πŒ·π„ (talk) 20:06, 27 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Ahhh, endlich geht die Seite wieder. Die war ja lange Zeit nicht aufrufbar. Ich habe jetzt Ulfilas als Schriftart, weil die viel schΓΆner ist, als die Schriftart, die eigentlich fΓΌr Wikipedia vorgesehen ist. Allerdings ist die meistens zu klein, und wenn bei Wikipedia an der linken Seite ein Interwikilink auf die gotische Artikelversion vorkommt, steht Gutiska immer viel zu klein da. Das frΓΌhere Problem bei der Default Schriftart, ich weiß grad gar nicht mehr wie sie heißt, ist, dass die Ober- und UnterlΓ€ngen abgeschnitten sind und selbst die RΓ€nder der normalen Schriftzeichen oben und unten abgeschnitten sind. Zylbath (talk) 20:15, 27 π…πŒ°π‚πŒΌπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Tower[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

How would you know that tower if feminine, unless an instance of it appear in the old texts?

Because the word I choosed "turs" is a loan word from latin "turris" which is female aswell. And we don't have another word for it in the gothic texts. The words like "baurgs" or "kelikn" don't mean "tower" as we need it. Zylbath (talk) 10:04, 2 πŒ·πŒ°π…πŒΉπŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2012 (UTC)

Free Gothic fonts[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hi Kevin. Are there any free Gothic-supporting fonts? I see that many listed on the project page are for non-commercial use only, and one has a question mark next to the license. If you want, I can help gotwiki by getting a Gothic font added as an option. See mw:ULS. PiRSquared17 (talk) 16:34, 5 πŒ°πŒΊπ‚πŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2013 (UTC)

Hello. The font used here is Skeirs by Robert Pfeffer, it's for all electronical display. Another very beautiful font by him is Ulfilas, it's also for free. Wikipedia is already displayed in Skeirs and the new Unicode has added Gothic with the Skeirs font. Zylbath (talk) 18:28, 5 πŒ°πŒΊπ‚πŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2013 (UTC)
For free (price) is different from free as in freedom. See here. Please see the section on the Universal Language Selector on ang.wikipedia, to see an example of how the font can be used without the user ever downloading the font. It can even be set by default, unlike on angwiki, where it is an option. I can also get a Gothic keyboard added, if you want. PiRSquared17 (talk) 20:32, 6 πŒ°πŒΊπ‚πŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2013 (UTC)
Note that I can only get a font added to ULS if it is free as in freedom. (e.g., you must be able to sell it, so non-commerical license is not enough)
That would be a good idea. That's one of the main problems here, that stranger people coming here by curiousity are seeing only sqaure boxes. But I am sorry I don't know any Gothic font that is totally free. Zylbath (talk) 09:51, 8 πŒ°πŒΊπ‚πŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2013 (UTC)

Your temporary access has expired[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hello, the temporary access you requested on this wiki has expired. Just to let you know that If you want it back, feel free to make a local announcement and open a new request on stewards' permission request page on Meta-Wiki later. Moreover, if you think the community is big enough to elect a permanent administrator, you can place a local request here for a permanent adminship, so stewards can grant you the permanent access. Please ask me or any other steward if you have any questions. Thank you! --MF-Warburg (talk) 23:06, 20 πŒ°πŒΊπ‚πŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2013 (UTC)

How do you change the title page from the Latin alphabet to the Gothic alphabet?[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

I can't seem to figure this out how you do that. Do you have to be an administrator or something? Everytime i try to search a page that doesn't exist and create it, it won't let me it just gives me this error message, "An error has occurred while searching: The search backend returned an error:." Moonspell Bloodlines (talk) 23:12, 3 πŒΊπŒ°πŒ»πŒ³πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Well, the same happens to me. But whenever you created a new page you can first do it in Latin script and then move it. I don't know whether you as a normal user can move pages, too. If so at the top bar next to the star and 𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌾𐌰𐌽 there is a little arrow showing downwards, there you can move pages. You then just type in the Gothic script and leave the check in the box where it says to leave a redirect for the old page. That's how I am doing it. We have to have all pages with Gothic script names, Latin script is just used for redirects. Also we don't use the slash-pattern anymore like πŒ²πŒΏπ„πŒΉπƒπŒΊπŒ°π‚πŒ°πŒΆπŒ³πŒ°/Gutiskarazda. The transcription of English names into Gothic script has some difficulties. I haven't written a guide to that yet but planning to do so. If you have questions to that just go ahead. ;) Zylbath (talk) 23:26, 3 πŒΊπŒ°πŒ»πŒ³πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

WikiLang[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hi. I can't see this going anywhere soon, honestly, but I replied on m:Talk:WikiLang. PiRSquared17 (talk) 02:34, 29 πŒΊπŒ°πŒ»πŒ³πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Why did you remove my talk?[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

I brought up the comparison with modern Hebrew as an inspiration for Gothic and you removed it. I don't really get why you remove it and I don't think that you are an antisemite, but if you remove content comparing Gothic with modern Hebrew I wonder if you remove it because of antisemitic motives. Bokareis (talk) 12:26, 26 πŒ°πŒΊπ‚πŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Hey, I am really soooo sorry. I must've hit some link or button. It wasn't really any intention. I am definitely not antisemitic, in fact, I speak a bit Hebrew. I am really sorry about that and I hope this won't happen again, it's really embarrassing. I was already wondering while typing the answer there. I was already dubious about myself for I was very certain that there was more text. Now I know it. So, a really big sorry again. :/ Zylbath (talk) 12:45, 26 πŒ°πŒΊπ‚πŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I understand it, no problem don't feel embarrassed. I just didn't really get it. :P

Yes, I speak some Hebrew too, it's quite interesting. Bokareis (talk) 20:25, 26 πŒ°πŒΊπ‚πŒ°πŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

The first magazine in Gothic[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hi Zylbath, I found a website today to create your own magazine and I used their tools to create a magazine in the Gothic language. What do you think? The only problem is that I don't know how to print it. http://joom.ag/0pTb Bokareis (talk) 21:47, 5 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC

I just found out that you can let them print hard covers, but it costs 10-20 dollars, so we could even print some issues for the people of the Verein der Gotischen Sprache etc. I can spend some dollars to let them deliver an issue of my own Gothic magazine to me, but I think that for more issues we are having the following issues: It's possible to use your own fonts, so that I can change all the Latin letters in Gothic one, but that costs money to do, a silver account costs $15.95 / MONTH, but that's a bit too much for me. Only if I can turn it off again I would do that. We don't have a major funding to do this, it costs a lot of money basically. Bokareis (talk) 22:00, 5 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Hey, I really love the idea but I still see some problems there. First: Copyright. Apparently you used some texts and pictures I am not sure of who the copyrights has. That could lead to a big issue if you publish that. Second: The purpose of that magazine. The price is fairly high for a magazine in which so far are only bible texts and parts of what has been translated so far like that communists thing. Those texts are already available for free and I don't really have an added value by that. I really love the idea, and it might be easier with InDesign to make a magazine. If you want the Verein could help publishing it when it has a final form, except when it comes to money, which we unfortunately don't have. ^^ Zylbath (talk) 11:15, 6 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
If the Verein hasn't any money it's better if you completely abolish the Verein, trying to revive Gothic without money is like trying to create a secret service without money. I also think that you should look at ways to change the Verein in an official organization, I have seen that die Verein der Gotischen Sprache isn't registered as an official association as far as I have understood, correct me if I 'm wrong, but that will not work if you want to do some serious work with the Verein. If the purpose is to bring some people interested in the Gothic language and culture in Germany together, I as a Dutch person for example can't attend meetings because it's too far away for me, without wanting to revive it it will work perfectly as it is now, but if you want to do serious efforts to revive it you should seek people which have the same objective, possibly some students, some teachers, Spanish or Italian people. As I have written almost all the texts in that magazine myself there are no copyright issues with that. I wrote that text about the Skeireins. I need to ask Fredrik if he would agree with his translation being partly used. The only thing which can give copyright issues is the poem from J.R.R. Tolkien.

Bokareis (talk) 15:33, 6 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

I guess you missunderstood the reason for that association. It is not our first aim to revive the Gothic language. Even if that idea seams romantic and I would be always in favour for that, realistically, I don't see any real chance for that going to happen. It is rather an association and platform for scientific and linguistical research. It is therefore also associated with the Germanistic studies in Germany of which we have a lot of members. It is also there to have a representative for the Gothic language. Something people can write to and ask question. We have a little library (really tiny, but I can't afford to buy books without ending ;)) and we are in contact with a lot of people that are firm in Gothic in order to refer to if somebody has a question. We are montoring projects and maybe can give feedback or our opinion onto it. We don't need money for most of the things. And maybe soon we will publish our first book about some linguistical topics. The resonance for our last call for papers was quite poor. And the reason for not being registered is simple: So far there is no need for it. We are not struggling with official recognition for that's not our aim. The process of registration is expensive and totally not worth the effort. We have to pay money, appear in front of the court and we have to send in a financial report every month. But since we don't have money nor real activity there's no need for it. But regarding the law there is almost no difference between a registered and a non-registered association. Maybe when there is money and when we publish the first book or something, I will think about. But the next step is maybe just to put it into an institute, that term is not officially protected or restricted to certain conditions.
To the copyright: I am speaking about the pictures for example. Are they all free to use? Don't get me wrong, I think the idea of a magazine is fantastic. But then it should offer some more value than only anything in Gothic. Like texts about certain topics that are interesting and more modern things (who would be bothered to read bible texts in a magazine? :)). Zylbath (talk) 16:01, 6 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Yes, I agree with you on the Bible thing, I just included it because I had to fill pages with Gothic and it takes me a lot of time to write these short texts in Gothic. That's also why, when I write news in Gothic I only do 1 or 2 article a day. Currently I haven't written anything in a long time....

Anyway I see your point. Publishing a book about linguistical topics is good, but I think the interest in Gothic would be increased if you would also publish books in bilingual Gothic - English or bilingual Gothic - German. If there is enough interest books which are solely Gothic might be an option too. My translation of the communist manifesto is far now, I have translated the complete chapter 4 and I have made quite some progress in chapter 3, but my translation project has stopped recently. http://communistmanifestoingothic.wordpress.com/

If Fredriks and my translation is finished, would you maybe want to publish 1 or 2 hardcover versions of the book for Die Verein der Gotischen Sprache, so that members can use at as study material? That means, as a way to improve their Gothic, as anyone with a good knowledge of the Gothic Bible will be able to read this too, although Fredriks translation of chapter 1 might be a bit complicated sometimes....

When it's finished I will see if I can send a hard-cover copy of the book to myself. I 'm very interested in what it will look like. The images are indeed not all free to use I think, but I wasn't planning to make a hardcover of this, I just did it to look what a magazine would look like. This is also a private link, which means that not everyone can see it so there are less copyright issues then.

Bokareis (talk) 17:30, 6 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

We are speaking of two interests in Gothic here, of which I do carry both somehow. On the one hand there is the mere interest in the language itself, its beauty and maybe the revival. And there's the other interest of a linguist, that is interested in the structure of that language, how it ressembles Indogermanic traces etc. And the last thing is the main aim of that association, the scientific exchange of information and research. There are still a lot of things that has be investigated, like the morpheme structure of Gothic, some etymologies etc. I am soon working on the dental preterite in Germanic languages and trying to show that it didn't derive from the grammaticalisation of the verb 'to do'. Publishing a two-way-book with texts in Gothic and English would be of course interesting, if the texts serves a good substance. But I can't put too much effort in it, the scientific purpose is not big enough. (But I'd consider publish on demand or new things like that. I am not sure yet.) The first publication aim is a scientific magazine with essays on linguistic topics like syntax or morphology, coming from hopefully several people.
If there is money I would consider buying it if it is worth it. (I have hardly enough money to have food at the end of the month, student life sucks. ;)) Zylbath (talk) 19:31, 6 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
This scientific purpose is what stops us from evolving Gothic in a language with literature and poetry. I think that it might be not a bad idea to motivate people to learn Gothic as a living language. Also, being able to speak Gothic makes scientific research much easier, as you use the material you learn in Gothic to write in it, which makes memorizing Gothic for scientific purposes much easier. Bokareis (talk) 19:44, 6 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
First, it does the opposite of stopping from evolving Gothic into a used language for it lays open how the language works which can influence how it'll be teached and revitalised. Second, as I said it is not our only or primary aim to revitalise Gothic. Being honest, I don't really see any real possibility of that happening in it, so I don't put that much effort in it. Of course it'd be romantic and I see a purpose of this Wikipedia and the efforts you are doing, but not with hoping that some day children start to speak Gothic. There is no culture, no Goths anymore, no state, no nothing that links to the historic Goths except for some that like the language. It'll be hard and very likely impossible to bring it back to live. It would be fantastic and I'd like to be proven wrong, but I have to stay realistic and so I am putting my efforts into the linguistical analysis of Gothic as that has direct effect on Germanistic studies and historical linguistics.
When you are investigating a language linguistically you don't have to be able to speak it. Most languages are, successfully, investigated by linguists that wouldn't be able to hold a simple conversation in it. You just have to know how to analyse structures, read dictionaries and grammars. And most of it is well attested when it comes to Gothic.
That being sad, we welcome any efforts of a possible revitalisation. But we cannot offer lots of ressources, money or time for following the same aim. When I am participating in most of those projects it is maybe rather 80% a personal hobby and 20% something the association is interested in. Zylbath (talk) 22:49, 6 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Eine Frage[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hallo, hast du der E-mail gelesen der ich dir geschickt habe?

Bokareis (talk) 20:07, 13 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)


English text on headpage[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hails,

I looked over the English text on the headpage, and I found that it could use some improvement.

Here's what I suggest:

"Only see squares? Download this font: Ulfilas (by Robert Pfeffer).

Don't speak Gothic? Gothic is an ancient East Germanic language spoken during the Dark Ages in Ukraine, Spain, Italy, and Aquitaine. It is the oldest Germanic language which we have a lot of knowledge of, and its vocabulary is highly similar to that of Old English. It is mostly known through a translation of the Bible made in the 4th century by Wulfila, an Ostrogothic bishop, but there are other writings in Gothic, such as a calendar, some records of financial transactions, and an explanation of the Bible known as the "Skeireins". The Skeireins is most likely written in native Gothic, and so it has a more complex structure than the Gothic Bible. Gothic is no longer spoken, and it has no descendants, but it can still be seen in Spanish, with words like "ganso" (goose), and in "Bagme Bloma", a poem by J.R.R Tolkien written in a reconstructed form of Gothic.

Gothic is written in an alphabet of its own. You will find fonts here, keyboard help here, and transliteration rules here."

Also, what's the story with your having to handle all MediaWiki translations here on got.wikipedia rather than at translationwiki? It must be a tad annoying. I think I read somewhere that it had something to do with someone converting everything to Latin, but now that that problem's being taken care of, don't you think you could try getting them to reΓ«nable it?

Tell me what you think.

Espreon (talk) 02:14, 20 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Hello. Thanks a lot for the revision of the English text. I guess it is already older than I am admin here. ;) I'll update it.
Concerning the translations: I have argued already sooo often on translatewiki to open the translation function again but the only thing I get back is stubbornness and meta discussions about how useless it is to have a dead language's Wikipedia. And for it is the stupidst thing they ever heard of they just won't open it... So I had to do it with MediaWiki. Kevin Behrens (talk) 09:30, 20 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
You're quite welcome.
I'll have to look into this myself. Right now, I can just say that this is absurd. On the bright side, I notified PiRSquared of your desire to have the transliteration mechanism he devised adapted and deployed here, so chances are he'll get to it sooner.
Espreon (talk) 10:21, 20 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Aw, that's really nice! Thanks a lot. =) That device should be very useful here. At best in Gothic, Latin and Runic script. Then, we can get rid of the dropdown boxes here. They do their service but they also load the database with so much useless text. Kevin Behrens (talk) 15:40, 20 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Hello Espreon, thanks for your help. I have built a PHP-tool to convert text to Gothic and Latin script, but I really get tired of adding those {latiniskamaideins} {anda} the whole time. Maybe if this is done we don't need to do that anymore.

Bokareis (talk) 21:31, 20 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

This dictionary[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

One thing. You have choosen Haubidaboka but for me "ufarmeli" looks a bit more logical, title.

Now my message: This dictionary is really annoying. When I need neologisms I use it, but it's completely incorrect as I see discussions here, I use wrong words for translations because of it and I even recommended a guy wanting to know the Gothic word for coffee for his merchandise to use KafΓ©s because that's what the dictionary said.

I hope you don't mind that people will be walking around with t-shirts which say coffee in Gothic with a wrong word made up by someone, because I checked the dictionary. Can you maybe simply take it offline if it's incorrect? Also new users will use all these wrong terms for their articles here.

Bokareis (talk) 21:40, 21 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

That is why I protected the site so not everybody can edit it and bring their selfmade neologism in it without discussing them with the community. Most of the words derived from the list of neologism from the gothic mailing list. I just included them. That's why I am revising the list now, which will be a hell of a work, but it's totally neccessary to make it more reliable. But as of now you shouldn't trust the list too much. It is full of mistakes and other stuff. But not always and I cannot take it offline for it contains also good words and many words that are already in use. We would generate a lot of synonyms if we make up new words unregarding the ones from the list. And then we can always replace the old ones if they are real shit. You can help with revision and discuss the words from the list of questionable words. Kevin Behrens (talk) 12:07, 22 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Yea for example, I have seen words that have the letter f in place of ΓΎ. Moonspell Bloodlines (talk) 20:36, 22 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
link I don't know if they are included yet but I agreed with Benjamin Johnson to use atgagganamo for username and gamotawaurd for password. Could you add those words to the dictionary so that other users know it too? talk 22:07, 22 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Page deleted[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Why was the page deleted? I was just asking because I work so hard on it. Moonspell Bloodlines (talk) 19:33, 22 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

It wasn't deleted. I just moved it to a proper name: πŒ²πŒ°πŒΌπŒ°πŒΉπŒ½πŒ°πŒ²πŒ°πŒΉπ‚πŒΌπŒ°πŒ½πŒΉπƒπŒΊπ‰πƒ 𐌲𐌿𐌳𐌰. ;) I will do the corrections tomorrow or so. I don't have the time for it today. But it is an important article. Thank you. Kevin Behrens (talk) 19:51, 22 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Oh I found the revised page after I posted this, so never-mind XD. I already did some edits on it. Moonspell Bloodlines (talk) 20:17, 22 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Flag[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

I was wondering if you still updated this website; I was hoping you could post an announcement for this idea I had. I'm trying to get as many people as possible to see this, so that we can come up with a voting system, and hopefully reach a consensus as to what the flag for Gothic should be. Also, if possible, could you spread it around to other websites that are participating in this movement, e.g. the Yahoo mailing list, if you have access to it? I don't, as far as I know, so I can't. I just thought it would be helpful if you could show it on your website. (Also, it's got a description in the picture in German already, so that's useful, though I'm sure I've made a lot of mistakes--I'd appreciate help with that, too.) Thanks in advance! --Shikku27316 (talk) 21:51, 25 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

I commented on it. When I find more time, I am going to tell others about it. Kevin Behrens (talk) 09:33, 26 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I replied there, it is important that you respond. Thank you. --Shikku27316 (talk) 18:27, 26 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
In my translation work several websites had problems with flags. So different flags are used at these websites now. Basically, www.polyglotclub.com uses this flag: http://polyglotclub.com/image/flag/lang/Language_Gothic.gif , and the localization website at which I do translationwork designed their own flag to show in their language list: https://d1ztvzf22lmr1j.cloudfront.net/images/flags/got.png , which can be seen in their language list: https://crowdin.com/languages .

I recommend that we first take this into consideration before choosing a new flag, as those websites would need to change their flags again, while I actually like both these flags. Shall I ask crowdin if we are allowed to use their flag for other use too? It's designed by their flag-design team and it doesn't look too bad to me. The full image of the flag designed at crowdin is this one: https://dub130.afx.ms/att/GetInline.aspx?messageid=c73f2879-1890-11e4-b063-002264c1c9fa&attindex=0&cp=-1&attdepth=0&imgsrc=cid%3aii_hy9un00l0_1478ba32ba9cea6e&cid=d57aa51d32f87f12&shared=1&hm__login=roel11112&hm__domain=live.nl&ip=10.148.154.8&d=d1064&mf=0&hm__ts=Wed%2c%2029%20Oct%202014%2014%3a10%3a41%20GMT&st=roel11112%25live.nl%407&hm__ha=01_5af44eb0e7ec6d17c251449927c1aea90357156bc32ce860852190686e508338&oneredir=1 Bokareis (talk) 14:09, 29 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

In my opinion, that flag, while very pretty, is too complex, and we really didn't vote to have it as the one for the language and community. I'd just like an official vote, to come up with the official flag of the language movement and culture revival. I think they'd be fine with changing the image. However, if you like that one over the rest of my options or something others come up with, you can vote for it, but I'd like to have a vote. Others can also suggest their own, until the official vote, which will make the one chosen official. If the websites have to change their flags, then so be it, because if the community of speakers decides one way, then it's official, and the other ways are not as appropriate anymore. I just want to have a vote somewhere, with the pictures of all the suggestions next to buttons on a poll, and then, by a certain date, the one with the most votes wins. We have to decide which few will make it to the voting, and then people can vote on that without having to log in to anything. Perhaps SurveyMonkey or something would be a good choice. The one from the website can be suggested, as can anytihng meaningful that you can suggest. What do you think? --Shikku27316 (talk) 20:52, 29 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Of course you can do that, I don't know however if that website will be happy as their team designed it. But you can do that. The problem is that too few people are currently involved in the Gothic revival community, so it would more look like a choice by few than choice by everyone. But, why not use an image of Visigothic art as a flag? Bokareis (talk) 22:11, 29 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Well, a piece of art doesn't work as a flag. You can't easily reproduce it in cloth, whereas any of my flags can be sewn or printed. Hopefully, all suggestions will. I think we really should vote on one. If that website wants to keep its flag, it can. If they are willing to change it, they can, too. If you show my DeviantArt posts on the Gothic Yahoo mailing list, we can generate interest, and maybe others will want to put in their own ideas. Then, we can take the most popular ones, and put them in a poll, and the winner gets to be official. It doesn't matter if it's a small community, I think it's okay. Can you please post the flag ideas on the mailing list? I'd like to see responses. Unfortunately, I cannot use the mailing list. When I see the most popular ideas, I'll set up a poll. --Shikku27316 (talk) 22:33, 29 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

I don't want to seem obsessed or something, but can we have more conversation on this? --Shikku27316 (talk) 20:11, 3 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Maybe you can discuss it in the most active Gothic IRC channel, #learngothic at AfterNet, you can come there with Mibbit http://widget00.mibbit.com/?server=mibbit.afternet.org&channel=%23learngothic. Bokareis (talk) 20:25, 3 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Pages with mixed-script titles and Wikidata[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hails,

I tagged some mixed-script-titled duplicate pages for deletion, and I noticed that are a bunch that have already been tagged but have not had their Wikidata pages updated. Since Wikidata acts as a centralized repository for interwiki links, it is important that you update it after tagging a mixed-script-titled page for deletion.

To update Wikidata, just go to a page, find and click "Edit links", go to "Wikipedia pages linked to this item", click "edit", go to the Gothic link, click the hollow circle with square next to the now-editable field, edit the link on the page you get, and click "Set the site link".

Also, PiRSquared17 gave me this thing that lists pages whose titles have slashes in them, which is therefore useful for finding these pages we want to get rid of.

Have fun.

Espreon (talk) 07:37, 26 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Hey, thank you for your help. I have been on the Wikidata page to change some links to an article here and it quite confusing and I didn't get it because some links were editable, some not and I couldn't relink it to the right page etc. The good auld times were so much easier. ;)
And how do I use that programme? Where do I have to post that? Kevin Behrens (talk) 09:35, 26 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Eh, to update the links at Wikidata, you really just have to do what I told you. As for your being unable to edit certain pages, it's just that some pages, such as the one for Village Pump pages, are deemed so critical that they have to be protected; such pages have to be edited by Wikidata administrators or whatever.
Speaking of Village Pump pages, shouldn't Wikipedia:πŒ±πŒ°πŒΏπ‚πŒ²πƒ πŒ±π‚πŒΏπŒ½πŒ½πŒ° be defined as the Village Pump page at Wikidata and meta:Distribution list rather than Wikipedia:πŒ±πŒ°πŒΏπ‚πŒ²πƒ πŒ²πŒ°π…πŒΉ (well, at the latter, it's defined as the non-existent Wikipedia:Community Portal, and I guess it doesn't work with redirects since nothing gets sent to Wikipedia:πŒ±πŒ°πŒΏπ‚πŒ²πƒ πŒ²πŒ°π…πŒΉ through Wikipedia:Community Portal)?
As for that program, you just use it as it is. It simply gives you pagenames on this Wikipedia that contain slashes. If you want changes to be made to it, ask PiRSquared17.
Espreon (talk) 11:51, 29 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I'm sorry. It would appear that it works differently now,.
Just hit the "edit" button, change the Gothic link, and hit the "save" button above the section. If it gets to the Gothic one and stalls, then the link must be registered under a different item, which you need to find and modify first.
Espreon (talk) 15:32, 29 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Translation[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hi Zylbath, I wanted to apologize for my previous behaviour, one user here showed it to me. As for what I wanted to say, I have got access to the translation of Translate Wiki and I 'm happy that it seems to work again and indeed seems to change the pages which you translate. I wanted to do a few recommendations for this Wiki and I can't seem to translate them with Translate Wiki: Aftumistos maideineis in the sidebar should be: Aftumistos maideinos, I think. I read in a Gothic grammar that i-stems which have the ending -eis, use -os for their plural. Furthermore I recommend to remove: Haubidaseido, Slumpmassig seido, Meina gawaurdja etc. and replace them with: Haubidaseida, Slumpmassig seida, meina gawaurda. Bokareis (talk) 21:33, 9 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Hello. So you are saying that translate wiki is opened again?? How is that working? It still says that it is closed. So, something you changed there got changed here? I can't even access the translations on translate wiki for Gothic.
To your suggestions: maideineis is already the plural of maideins, fi. -jan verbs often take the noun ending '-eins'. You are right about haubidaseida. What is slumpmassig seida? Never seen that before. About gawaurdja: it is the plural of 'gawaurdi'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 21:46, 9 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Ok, now it's clear to me why it says Gawaurdja. But why is the plural used? πƒπŒ»πŒΏπŒΌπ€πŒΌπŒ°πƒπƒπŒΉπŒ² πƒπŒ΄πŒΉπŒ³π‰ is the left side bar, under aftumistos maideineis, no idea what it means, I never encountered slumpmassig. As for translation wiki, I was able to translate Translate Wiki and Wiki Media in it. I just can't translate the normal Wikipedia. Bokareis (talk) 21:59, 9 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Ah, I guess it is supposed to mean 'random'/'zufΓ€llig'. I don't know how one came to that, but in Low German 'slumpen' still means to 'work out randomly/accidentally'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:22, 9 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Can't you change it in *wiljahalΓΎs, as reconstructed by Koebler? A neologism is not needed if a reconstruction already exists. Bokareis (talk) 22:28, 9 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
But that word doesn't fit the meaning of 'random' well enough I'd say. 'random' is the absence of will whereas 'willekeurig' or 'wiljahalΓΎs' is rather the opposite, when the will can be anything. wiljahalΓΎs would thus be literally translated as 'for the will's sake'. Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:56, 9 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Fair enough. Then we will look at another word which is a good alternative. Bokareis (talk) 23:43, 9 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Funny thing about "slumpmassig". Has anyone else noticed, it's just a transliteration of the Swedish "slumpmΓ€ssig"? How about "dudruseigs", based on German "zufΓ€llig" and Norwegian "tilfeldig"? ("fallan" is not attested in Gothic.)--Shikku27316 (talk) 21:06, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Haha who came up with 'slumpmassig'? "Very Gothic"... ;) I would suggest 'atdriuseigs' 21:26, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I agree with one of these. Now a question to Zylbath: I believe you can still change the interface. Could you change this in the sidebar: slumpmassig to one of the two coined terms which are given here, you can look yourself which one is the best. And I see "haubidaseido" which needs to be "haubidaseida". And I just saw this: πŒΌπŒ°πŒ³πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ πŒΈπ‰πŒΆπŒ΄πŒΉ πŒ²πŒ°π…πŒΉπƒπƒπŒΎπŒ°πŒ½πŒ³ πŒ·πŒΉπŒ³π‚πŒ΄, someone forget to type the "i" between "m" and "a" in maideins". Bokareis (talk) 21:39, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Firefox in Gothic[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

I got access to a translation project for Firefox in Gothic. I have a question now which is quite important. How should I translate "firefox" and "mozilla"? Keep them the same, or the Gothic transliteration? I will in fact use the Roman script, because the Gothic one might give problems to some browsers and maybe Firefox can't even use it, I have seen more websites etc. which can't display it. Another question: downloads, can I translate this as: dalahlaΓΎeis? Based on: dalahlaΓΎan. Another question, if I translate something like: search, how should I translate it? Sokjan? or Sokja? I choose always choose sokjan, but is it really correct? I think "sok" might be more correct, as that's the imperative, but Dutch doesn't use the imperative in fact and just uses: "zoeken" at websites, like German "suchen", instead of the imperative. Should we use the complete verb in Gothic too in this context? The Goths didn't have websites so we have some freedom here too. Bokareis (talk) 23:42, 9 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Another question. I use the existing ananiuan for updates, as that means to make something new. How would I translate update? "ananiua" or "ananiueins"? I think "ananiua" as "giban" has "giba". Bokareis (talk) 23:45, 9 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
If you want to help in the translation, you can do it here: http://mozilla.locamotion.org/ Bokareis (talk) 00:00, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I would just leave Firefox and Mozilla that way, they are brands and only get seldomly translated. The noun 'download' should be indeed derived from 'dalahlaΓΎan' but the male -ja stem seems to be the wrong choice. I'd go with 'dalahlaΓΎa', fo. For search you could use: sokeins or gasokeins, fi. or the imperative of sokjan which is 'sokei' not 'sok'. That depends on the context. Sometimes the noun is needed and sometimes you'd need the imperative or the infinitive. All would be fine.
You mean 'ananiujan'? I guess it would be okay for 'update'. The noun would then be 'ananiueins' fi. Kevin Behrens (talk) 00:12, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
If I could give my opinion: I think we should just follow the pattern used by all other languages: use the infinitive for Gothic. German uses "suchen", French uses "rechercher", etc., so let's stick to that and use "sokjan". If "ananiujan" is the infinitive, then it should be "ananiueins". "DalahlaΓΎan" would be "dalahlaΓΎΓ‘ins" when made into a noun. --Shikku27316 (talk) 20:48, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Thanks for your contribution Shikku, could you give a source why -an changes into -ains and not -a like Zylbath says? Bokareis (talk) 20:49, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
How do you come to that ending -Γ‘ins, Shikku? Just curious. Or maybe we could use the ablaut for the noun as that is also common to a load of nouns: dalahloΓΎ - download. Kevin Behrens (talk) 21:07, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I was discussing with the admin, and you can input in the Gothic unicode in the project, but the problem is that the standard font for the Gothic unicode isn't a very good representation of the real Gothic, some other fonts look a lot like it, but for some reason I can read images of old Gothic manuscripts with ease, but the Gothic unicode gives me problems with "r" and "k", so I will try to find out if we can use a different font for the Gothic version. As there is no limit, Gothic will maybe already in about 6 weeks be available, as far as I have understood, and they will update it each time. Bokareis (talk) 21:20, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Here and here, but I've seen it for strong verbs, too. However, since I can't remember any examples, it's best to stick to either the ablaut form or -a. --Shikku27316 (talk) 21:22, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Okay, thank you for the links. Forming nouns from verbs is unfortunately not really an exact science. Mostly it's convention that decides what morphological pattern is being used. But I guess the ablaut is a quite useful method here, it makes the word comfortable short and still easy to identify. ;) Kevin Behrens (talk) 21:32, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Interesting material Shikku! :) I think I will stick with -a, the verb giban also removes the -n for it's noun and it's the most convenient and easy way to do it. Can you agree with that? I don't want to decide everything myself so I want to hear your opinion if I make nouns from -an verbs by removing -n, as I need to translate a lot. Bokareis (talk) 21:36, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Another question. I come across the word "system" now, as every language uses an equivalent I use "sistema" now, but is this a good Gothic word? What was the original Greek word? We should base it on that. Bokareis (talk) 21:43, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
You're welcome. I think strong -an verbs should use either ablaut or -a, and weak -an verbs should use -Γ‘ins; "giban" has "giba", and giban is a strong verb, while "liban", a weak verb, uses "libΓ‘ins". "System" would probably be "swsteima", but I don't know what gender and stem; maybe weak neutre noun "swsteimō". Gothic words from Greek ones usually turn Ο… into w, and Ξ· into ei. --Shikku27316 (talk) 22:03, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Is it really incorrect to use the infinitive? I think that using the imperative everywhere is not in correspondance with other languages and makes it much harder to do. For example: "Toon resultaten" can also be "Resultaten tonen" in Dutch, just as in German "Suchen" and "Such" can both be used. Also this wikipedia uses the infinitive in a lot of places for actions like "search". Bokareis (talk) 22:55, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Personally, I prefer the infinitive. --73.52.120.157 23:01, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

I have been searching, and in fact there are attestations in the Gothic Bible of the infinitive being used as an imperative: http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/2914522?uid=3738736&uid=2&uid=4&sid=21104502250601, it should be perfectly fine to use it as an imperative, but the imperative itself isn't wrong neither, compare: "search", "suchen", I think we should have both, just as all languages. Bokareis (talk) 23:03, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Re: Flag[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

In the IRC, we said that I would get back to you about the flag if you did not get back to me by now. So, I hope I don't seem obsessive! So, will you make the announcement for it? I want there to be rules; I've prepared the following. Try to make the words link to what they link to here, if you can do that with Facebook and the Yahoo Group. Here they are:
Rules for submissions of a Gothic flag:
-Follow the rules of the North American Vexillogical Association: Keep it simple, use meaningful symbolism, use under 4 or 5 basic colours, no lettering or seals/coats of arms, be distinctive or be related (such as using the 3-colour style of most Germanic flags).
-This is not a flag for the Goth subculture or anything to do with Gothic horror, but with the Visigoths, Ostrogoths, Crimean Goths, Balkan Goths, and related tribes, their Gothic language, and their culture. Try not to use too much symbolism from the unrelated Goth subculture and Gothic horror.
-No photographs or detailed charges. If you want to put a symbol on, keep it to one or two colours, and perhaps leave it as a basic shape or silhouette.
-Remember that a flag is something that will be sewn in fabric. It should not be too detailed so that it cannot be sewn easily. (i.e., stick to stripes and shapes, and not graphics, letters and seals).
-No gradients, β€œpaint splash” shapes, scrapes, pictures of people etc. These violate the NAVA rules and the above rule. -Patterns are allowed, but not too detailedβ€”this is perhaps too detailed.
-All in all, we’re looking for a sew-able flag, not a logo!
How about that? --Shikku27316 (talk) 21:54, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

I can post this at the IRC. But the maximum amount of users is 3, so it won't be that useful. As for the Yahoo group, you can register there yourself. I can post this for you, but I think that not a lot of people will react. Maybe nobody at all. I 'm not at Facebook so I can't do that for you. Bokareis (talk) 22:01, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
The problem is, I can't access the mailing list. I know I have to get accepted in and everything, but there are just issues I'd rather just not mention, you know. If you could post this there, with my original picture (it's further up in the page here), that would be good. Simply because I can't. Or, I could write this all out on my DeviantArt, and you could just post that? I may just end up with that. (By the way, I just finished rading Alice in Wonderland in English, and I'd like to help with the translation, if that's okay. Can you tell me which chapters I should do? I'll put them on DA and then on your talk page.) --Shikku27316 (talk) 22:07, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
That sounds great. I found a translation of chapter 7 and I 'm doing chapter 1, so maybe you can do whatever other chapter, maybe chapter 2? Ehm, do you possibly have an e-mail so that we can discuss it? You can post it at my talk page yes, then I will proof-read it and try to remove mistakes which I mention. This sounds great. If we can translate the whole book together with multiple people we could maybe publish it. Bokareis (talk) 22:21, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Alright, here's the flag announcement: http://shikku27316.deviantart.com/journal/Gothic-flag-announcement-493772944 Please spread this!
I'd like to see that Chapter 7 translation! Can you link me to it? Also, I'll do Ch. 2, just tell me which mistakes you find in it, okay? --Shikku27316 (talk) 22:24, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Here it is: http://web.uvic.ca/~dcarlton/Gothic%20alice%20chapter%207.pdf, I tried to contact the translator, but I don't know how to contact him. Bokareis (talk) 22:37, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I just looked at the chapter 7 translation. It uses "AΓΎalhaids" for "Alice", where you use "Aleisja". We may have to also check over it (and add those diacritics!). All the words in there have to be made sure to be the same throughout not just the whole book, but the whole language. (Same with the Nicene Creed--the translator used "liuhaΓΎa" where it should be "liuhada".) --Shikku27316 (talk) 22:40, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Robot[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

How can I translate the word robot in Gothic? Should I just translate it as "robaut" or "robot"? I know that "skalks" exists which has the same meaning as the Slavic/Czech "robot", but that can give a wrong impression as to what is ment. Bokareis (talk) 22:23, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Yes, I'd say "robot", neuter a-stem would b best. --Shikku27316 (talk) 22:46, 10 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Why is it my own problem?[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Everyone here is using this dictionary and if people are writing articles with wrong words, directly taken over from this dictionary, it obviously isn't only my problem, but other peoples problem too. Bokareis (talk) 20:51, 24 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Ok, now I see that I was stupid by not editing everything, because I didn't want to spend time on correcting the rest so that there are mistakes in the other Gothic there now. Bokareis (talk) 20:53, 24 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I am happy if you correct the Gothic, you can post the corrections on the discussion page, I protected the portal's page now in the light of the currect event. The main page is not a place to express your anger about the dictionary. If you don't like it it is a personal problem that you could express on a page where it is useful but not out of the emotion on the main page. The page with the actual dictionary already has a warning at the top, that should be enough. It should be clear that our dictionary is not a divine, absolute decree but a colloborative work that is neither perfect nor finished yet. If one uses such sources in the internet one should always be clear in one's mind that it always requires counterchecking and is not really reliable. Kevin Behrens (talk) 21:41, 24 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
First of all, I was not expressing anger, I just thought that currently there is not a good warning about the dictionary: "Up to the mark the words are revised on this list and can be, with caution, used on this Wikipedia or elsewhere. Yet, we cannot guarentee correctness.", this is not bad, but I would recommend to add or edit in something like: "Use this dictionary with caution, some words may be inaccurate", the reason why I say this, is because you started this sentence with: "up to the mark the words are revised", most people in these days stop reading quickly and it's important to put such a notice at the beginning of a sentence, and not at the end of it. As I can't edit the dictionary, I was putting a warning there to make it clear to every user, and that's why I did it in English, which fortunately is done here, although it's not put obviously enough in place, according to me. Bokareis (talk) 00:23, 26 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Gothic words?[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hello,

Trying to find a source for this page: πŒ±πŒ°πŒ½πŒ³πŒ°π‚πŒ΄πŒΉπŒΊπŒΎπŒ°, I didn't find. But maybe my research was bad. Would you have a source for this page, an example of use of this term?

Thanks by advance, Automatik (talk) 19:05, 6 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Hello, I don't really get what your question is, sorry. :S Are you asking how the word 'bandareikja' is used or are you asking for some certain words from the article or do you want a content source for the information on the page? Kevin Behrens (talk) 19:08, 6 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I'm asking if the word πŒ±πŒ°πŒ½πŒ³πŒ°π‚πŒ΄πŒΉπŒΊπŒΎπŒ° have been really used in Gothic, and if it's the case, how do you know it? (Sorry if my English is not quite clear). Automatik (talk) 19:35, 6 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Hello Automatik. As the Gothic language is known from around the 3rd up to the 8th century A.C., and America got known by Columbus after the year 1000 (the Vikings came there earlier, but they never made it known to the rest of the world like Columbus), the Goths didn't even know this place so logically they didn't have a word for it. Therefore someone came up with the neologism Bandareikja, based on banda (united, I assume, but I need to look up where this comes from) + reikja (states), which seems good to me. Bokareis (talk) 22:21, 6 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Bokareis is right. Many phenomena, things, situations etc. didn't exist when the Gothic language was spoken. Thus, we have to make up words which seem appropriate to Gothic and logical in comparison to other, espacially Germanic, languages. Kevin Behrens (talk) 12:17, 7 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Aftumistos maideinos[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hi Zylbath, I just did extensive work to find a nominative plural of a Fio stem, as most attested Fio words actually don't have one, after a while I came across this word Birodeins: http://www.wulfila.be/gothic/browse/lemma/?ID=510. If we apply this nominative plural as a rule to all unattested Fio words, it should be in fact: Aftumistos maideinos, instead of maideineis, as the word is a Fio stem, according to Wulfila.be and Koebler. Bokareis (talk) 03:22, 7 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Hello. 'fi/o' stems are just an alternation to 'fi' stems. 'fi' is the regular one for which all the endings are well attested. Normally the nominalisation of '-jan' verbs ends with this noun stem. 'fi/o' stems, however, are an alternation to the 'fi' stems. Abstract nouns deriving from the weak verbs of classes I, II and III can be found here, but not exclusively. They inflect in singular like 'fi' stems and in the plural they sometimes change to an 'fo' declination. They are therefore to be seen as irregular nouns. I don't think it is a productive rule, which can be also seen at the inconsistent changes within one paradigm: naiteins 'fi/o' (blasphemy), Nom. Pl. naiteinos 'fo' but Acc. Pl. naiteinins 'fi'. It changes categories within one plural paradigm. So it is not concistent and not a productive rule. A general paradigm, thus, can't be reconstructed. I know KΓΆbler lists 'madeins' as an 'fi/o' stem but I wouldn't go so far. 'madeins' isn't attested at all, only 'inmaideins' two times, with a consistent 'fi' paradigm. I don't know why he is saying it is an 'fi/o' stem, the plural isn't attested at all. In those moments, when we can't rely on attested forms, we have to assume regularity over irregularity. We cannot know what plural forms decline as 'fi' and what like 'fo'. So, in my opinion, I would leave it like 'aftumistos maideineis'. Maybe a genuin Gothic from then might say it is wrong but I would give it a rest until we invent time travelling and can tell for true. ;) Would that be okay with you? Kevin Behrens (talk) 13:12, 7 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I understand it. So it doesn't really matter at all. I will ask it at the gothic-l group again. I use inmaideinos, but if it isn't attested it doesn't really matter what we use. Again, I will ask the experts in the gothic-l group.

By the way, i 'm at my mobile now, and as i don't have and can't install a gothic unicode font, i 'm pretty limited to my use of the gothic wikipedia on it.

Ok, I re-asked it in the Gothic-l group, and a linguist told me there that "maideineis" is simply wrong, as it's an Fi/o-stem, it should be simply maideinos. If you want I can refer you to his full explanation. I will use maideinos etc. in my translations, it's your own choice and totally up to you if you want to use "maideineis" at Wikipedia, it is linguistically wrong, but I won't force you to use it, the quality of the Gothic wikipedia depends on the community after all. Bokareis (talk) 22:17, 8 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Oh, thank God you won't force me... I didn't make the translation of that. I'll answer to the conversation on the gothic-l group when I get accepted (lost my password for the old account and had to make a new account). And I will change the translation here. Surely, out of pure free will you are granting me... -.- Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:39, 8 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
I just say that you are the admin, so you decide what happens here, not me. That's why I say, free will. You didn't need to change it, I just said that a linguist who knows a lot of ancient Germanic language agrees with me. I see that you react in a sarcastic way, so it might be better if I stop trying to improve this wikipedia. Bokareis (talk) 22:48, 8 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
You are always welcome to help, but just if your tone is sincere and not manipulative, defiant or pretentious. Sorry to say it so directly, but that is what I am experiencing since a long time, I just swallowed it the whole time in the sake of the Wikipedia. But when doing teamwork you really have to change your manner of talking to others. Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:56, 8 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Ok. Like I said, I will try to not contribute anymore, in fact in other places I 'm generally kind, but for some reason Wikipedia is the perfect website to piss people off. Bokareis (talk) 23:07, 8 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)

Flag poll[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

The flag poll has been up for a while now: [1], don't pay much mind to the rest of the Wiki, it's my old Vandalic one which is out of date (I've changed a lot about the language since then). Could you promote this anywhere else possible? Feel free to vote, too. --Shikku27316 (talk) 21:30, 17 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)`

Oh, nice job. This time there are really cool flags. :) Now I'm having a hard time to choose. Do you have some more information on the flags and what the colours and forms should stand for? That would help me a lot. But that wikia is really interesting and now I am noticing that I have never paid attention to that language. When I am launching the Gothic Institute webpage, would you be interested in doing some research or work on Vandalic? I think that would fit just perfect and it could be great work to complete the work on Gothic. Kevin Behrens (talk) 21:44, 17 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Well, A1 was invented by a company called "Crowdin", so you'd have to ask them. The cross, though, is a common Gothic cross symbol. On A2 and B1, green is the Visigoths; red is the Ostrogoths; yellow is the Vandals, Burgunians, and Gepids; and purple is the other Goths (Crimean, Moesian, etc.). A3 and B3 are similar, and B2 is pretty obvious (the common eagle fibula on a black field is all, the colours are similar to other medieval Germanic flags so I quite like that one). A4 and B4 use the same eagle, but A4 is based on the flag of Asturias, and the other doesn't have an explanation for the colours, but I picked that one. You don't even need an account to vote!
The Vandalic on that Wiki is ridiculously out-of-date; I've made many reforms of it: for example, the Wiki sais "Vandalic" is "gwandilΔ“ska", but now I call it "wandalska rasda" or "wandlska rasda". Don't trust it until I've updated it. I'd be happy to provide Vandalic things for the Institute, but not full-time: my schedule is very full, but I have lots of time for Vandalic. I can provide translations, literature, etc. I hope to set up a personal website soon, where I can post about Gothic and Vandalic, but not exclusively. When that's up, I'll show you and you can (if you want) affiliate or something of the like. Also, I don't know if you know French, but have you seen this? It's a kind of a Burgundian reconstruction. I've been meaning to ask the creator for his intentions soon. --Shikku27316 (talk) 22:10, 17 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)`
Thank you for the explanations. I also chose B2. Regarding the work on Vandalic, it wouldn't be a full-time thing. But basically you can do whatever you want there. I am also thinking of serious research or work, like linguistical analyses or a webpage were all the Vandalic related language relicts are collected and are translated. Also would a reconstruction be very interesting. The page about Burgundic is very interesting. It is perfect training for my French ;) But it'll be quite a time until I will be ready to launch the Gothic Institute. I am always having too many projects. ^^ Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:47, 17 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)
Alright, I'll send you some translations when you're ready. --Shikku27316 (talk) 20:25, 21 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)`
By the way, could you make an announcement about the flag poll perhaps on the main page? --Shikku27316 (talk) 20:25, 28 πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2014 (UTC)`

Your temporary access has expired[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hello, the temporary access you requested on this wiki has expired. Just to let you know that If you want it back, feel free to make a local announcement and open a new request on stewards' permission request page on Meta-Wiki later. Moreover, if you think the community is big enough to elect a permanent administrator, you can place a local request here for a permanent adminship, so stewards can grant you the permanent access. Please ask me or any other steward if you have any questions. Thank you! Stryn (talk) 14:41, 13 π…πŒ΄πŒΉπŒ½πŒΌπŒ΄πŒ½π‰πŒΈπƒ 2015 (UTC)

Help with clean-up[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hi Kevin, I give 15 days (about 2 weeks) to start to help with a clean-up. Ways to help is by correcting mistakes you see, removing the latin text box etc. Otherwise I 'll start removing all bad articles for which I don't have the energy to correct them. It's not ment to make people feel uncomfortable that I do this, but we need a Wikipedia without crap articles to be taken seriously. I cleaned up a lot aslready, but if we need to remove a lot of articles and keep about 200 articles to make a fresh good start with correct articles, so be it, quality should be prerfered over quantity. Bokareis (talk) 22:00, 11 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2015 (UTC)

Hi. As I don't have any time left in the next time because of my studies I unfortunately can't help with that. You are the admin here now and have to decide on things. :) But can I make a suggestion? You should still caracterise articles that have mistakes. There may be articles that have mistakes but are rather long and seem have taken a lot of effort. They should still be left on the Wikipedia, whereas articles that only have one or two sentences and mistakes could be deleted when no clean-up has been done. It is not there would come the grammar police and scold us for bad language. I can understand you that you want
to clean this up and I totally second that but still there should be room for bigger articles, even if they have mistakes. (I guess the original aim for this wikipedia wasn't explicitly correct language but rather to create a bigger corpus and play along with an old, dead language and have fun with it.) The length and the need to delete mistakes should be weighed independantly. And maybe your clean-up efforts as well, which means that you should spend your efforts on correcting mistakes in articles that are worth it and not just one or two sentences, even if they were easier to correct. That would be my fifty cents for that. :) Greetings, Kevin Behrens (talk) 22:22, 11 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2015 (UTC)
Don't worry Kevin, about long articles I think the same way as you, I 'll put them on a kind of queue for correction. Only if a long article is incompredhensible, like was the case with the Germanic gods one, it gets deleted, because it's useless to have an incomprehensible article.

As for how we write here, this was in the days when Gothic was still very limited in irsuse, withall the books etc in Gothic I don't recommend just trying to write somrthing and to have a grammatically correct wiki. I 'll try to see if we can write so ethinhg like a good guide forbasic use. I wish you luck, and don't mind to contribute here. Bokareis (talk) 12:14, 13 π†π‚πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2015 (UTC)

Diskussion über Interface[𐌹𐌽𐌼𐌰𐌹𐌳𐌴𐌹]

Hallo Kevin, ich mΓΆchte dich fragen zu partizipieren in der Diskussion, ich bin jetzt am besprechen was wir mit der Interface machen sollen, so kann es nicht weiter. Gothic interface discussion Bokareis (talk) 12:35, 8 πŒ°π†π„πŒΏπŒΌπŒ° πŒΎπŒΉπŒΏπŒ»πŒ΄πŒΉπƒ 2016 (UTC)